d20pfsrd Data Sets - Powered by Hero Lab....

[ShadowChemosh]

Mild bug: one of the files is named "PFRG_Carrion_Crown_AP.user".

Works fine, mind you, but if a well-intentioned user were to rename it "correctly", and update to a later version, it would effectively duplicate the file.

Sort of why I don't change it actually as it means I would have to put in a "Delete" then of the file named "PFRG" otherwise gamers upgrading would get hit with Duplicate Thing errors. I really try and do do as little "Delete" of files as I can as I am always nervous about removing files from peoples systems.

So as it does not really hurt anything I have just left the incorrect name for now....

 

[ShadowChemosh]

I haven't had a chance to go through in detail and see exactly which files have mistakes, but I see a number of issues if I enable the community bestiary and the other community sources. I apologize if some of these are not actually CB issues...

1) Lots and lots of duplicates, both in the races, and in templates. For example, there are two copies of the Dread <undead> templates.

Yes I know. I have asked the editors to NOT duplicate the same stuff but they really don't seem to have time to double check. So we have some monsters that are listed 4 times now. The issue I have is "who's" do I delete? When I have just done some "adjustments" before some editors have been a little upset. I understand as they put hard work into something and who I am "I" to change/adjust their stuff?

Next thing is removing "Things" can cause some weird issues. Especially as what if a person has created special version of a undead using "Dread" template and used version B not version A. If I delete Version B their .por files are now totally busted. how *happy* they going to be about that?

I really have no good idea how to solve these issues right now....

1a) Most of the time, the details are identical, but there are a few where the two entries vary. An example of that would be the Bombardier Beetle. Did they come from two different sources with different stats?

Most likely they where done by different editors at the same time. As noted above I am not sure how to solve this right now. I am nervous about "pissing" editors off as they do this all for "FREE".

2) Speaking of not being able to track it down. The Beholder is somewhere in one of my data files. Can someone confirm that it's just me, or did WOTC PD end up in one of the data files?

I don't remember seeing Beholder but I will look. If I find it will have to delete it as its not OGL and very copy righted. As far as I know the only thing close is the "Eye Tyrant" or something like that from a 3PP.

3) Can we standardize on "Appears in" in the description of the race? Some entries have them and other entries do not.

I would love to be able to do this. The problem here is that this should be done by a central person say myself. The logistics problem of me doing this is huge. I make the changes to dozen monsters in 6 different .user files. Another editor is making changes also to some of the same files as they maybe files with their names on it even. Then trying to merge the data from their changed .user files with my changed .user file is a NIGHTMARE. I found a tool that can do a compare of differences at the XML level but its $300 bucks for the software. I love doing this but not $300 bucks worth.

If someone knows a Cheaper or free version that could help. The problem is still takes allot of time to then see what the differences are and copy/paste just pieces of XML from one document to another.

Now if this works I have created really a 3rd version of the .user file that now contains both my changes and the editors changes. Do to the time to do this to a dozen files 2 weeks have gone by. I release this new version. The Editor has been moving forward with NEW changes based on his "older" version. Then he submits his now "totally" outdated version of the .user file that has to be merged in with pieces again.

I think I got a little off point but that is the reason I don't do it. I can setup a set of standards and "ask" editors to follow them but if they don't they don't.

4) A number of entries like 'Portal Golem', rather than 'Golem, Portal.'

See above same thing.

5) This may be more of a philosophical issue, but there are a number of specific NPCs in the community bestiary. For example, Xulthos from the Legacy of Fire AP. He's a modified Glomeray Daemon, which is also in the bestiary... shouldn't NPCs like that be done via .por files?

Here you getting into the history of things. LoF is very old and no Bestiary existed at that time I don't think. So either A) the editor didn't know Bestiary had it or didn't even own the Bestiary data package B) the Bestiary data set came out after this was created or C) the editor felt at the time that even if you didn't have the Bestiary you should still have access to Xulthos.

Either way its their and see above for why I don't remove it.

6) The text for the Ghast reads that Ghasts are Ghouls with the advanced monster template. If that's the case, why do they have an entry? Why not just apply the advanced monster template to Ghouls?

Ghasts where not templates in 3.5 so I am 99% sure these came from the original Rise of the Runelords AP or from a 3PP. So again what you dealing with is what version is the Ghast from and you can't assume its the latest rules from Pathfinder.

Their is allot of history to monsters.

 

[Unseelie]

Yes I know. I have asked the editors to NOT duplicate the same stuff but they really don't seem to have time to double check. So we have some monsters that are listed 4 times now. The issue I have is "who's" do I delete? When I have just done some "adjustments" before some editors have been a little upset. I understand as they put hard work into something and who I am "I" to change/adjust their stuff?

Next thing is removing "Things" can cause some weird issues. Especially as what if a person has created special version of a undead using "Dread" template and used version B not version A. If I delete Version B their .por files are now totally busted. how *happy* they going to be about that?

I really have no good idea how to solve these issues right now....

That's totally fair, and I didn't mean to sound like I was complaining. I know this has to be a pain to try and coordinate. That said, I worry a little bit because this seems like an issue that will only get worse over time.

I don't remember seeing Beholder but I will look. If I find it will have to delete it as its not OGL and very copy righted. As far as I know the only thing close is the "Eye Tyrant" or something like that from a 3PP.

I'll keep trying to isolate it and see if I can figure out where it came from as well. Since this is a clean install of the Mac version of Hero Lab, I am reasonably sure that it's not some random file I installed.

I would love to be able to do this. The problem here is that this should be done by a central person say myself. The logistics problem of me doing this is huge. I make the changes to dozen monsters in 6 different .user files. Another editor is making changes also to some of the same files as they maybe files with their names on it even. Then trying to merge the data from their changed .user files with my changed .user file is a NIGHTMARE. I found a tool that can do a compare of differences at the XML level but its $300 bucks for the software. I love doing this but not $300 bucks worth.

If someone knows a Cheaper or free version that could help. The problem is still takes allot of time to then see what the differences are and copy/paste just pieces of XML from one document to another.

Hell... I'd donate towards that if it would make your 'job' easier and the final result better. Assuming it wouldn't cause problems with Lone Wolf, maybe a paypal donation button?

I think I got a little off point but that is the reason I don't do it. I can setup a set of standards and "ask" editors to follow them but if they don't they don't.

Standards are good. That's why we have so many of them.

 

[ShadowChemosh]

That's totally fair, and I didn't mean to sound like I was complaining. I know this has to be a pain to try and coordinate. That said, I worry a little bit because this seems like an issue that will only get worse over time.

Its no problem at all and I figured you where not complaining. Its nice in many ways to get feed back as it means people are using this data set.

I have actually seen people posting about the CB on the paizo boards so word of it is spreading. It does mean some "clean" up work is really needed to standardize the data set. Hmmm things to think about...

 

[blzbob]

Let me put this out there, if you feel the need to change my work to better fit the community, go right ahead. I have no problems with it at all.

 

[bodrin]

Let me put this out there, if you feel the need to change my work to better fit the community, go right ahead. I have no problems with it at all.

Ditto. Feel free to edit / replace as you see fit.

Heck you maintain the dataset from goodwill alone. I for one wouldn't have the time to update / edit / upload and continue with the day job.

If the functionality is maintained and a standard naming / data convention is employed by removing / replacing duplicates then it should create a better end user experience for all to see. As long as the authors are credited and the change log is updated it shouldn't matter.

Perhaps drafting a few community data input submission guidelines, with the collaboration of the authors, and getting a sticky post upon the boards for everyone's perusal at this juncture would be beneficial for all.

 

[Lord Magus]

Ditto. Feel free to edit / replace as you see fit.

Heck you maintain the dataset from goodwill alone. I for one wouldn't have the time to update / edit / upload and continue with the day job.

(...) As long as the authors are credited and the change log is updated it shouldn't matter.(...)

My opinion too. Feel free to edit/replace the few things I have contributed!

 

[ShadowChemosh]

Awesome thanks guys.

My only plan I can think off is after the next release to do a sort of Half-Freeze where no changes will be put in only NEW things in New .user files. This would give me the chance to spend a few weeks sorting and changing everything. I am still nervous about removing stuff but I think I have an idea on how to fix or allow a fall back maybe without breaking all the .por files.

See if I can cut out some time to do something like this.

 

[CorzatTheGray]

Ditto. Feel free to edit / replace as you see fit.

Heck you maintain the dataset from goodwill alone. I for one wouldn't have the time to update / edit / upload and continue with the day job.

If the functionality is maintained and a standard naming / data convention is employed by removing / replacing duplicates then it should create a better end user experience for all to see. As long as the authors are credited and the change log is updated it shouldn't matter.

Perhaps drafting a few community data input submission guidelines, with the collaboration of the authors, and getting a sticky post upon the boards for everyone's perusal at this juncture would be beneficial for all.

+1
The CB is definitely appreciated and in my opinion, if the end result is better for the community then all the better to set the standards and adjust as needed.

All the hard work of all the contributors is GREATLY appreciated, and I don't think anyone would/should fault your hardwork, Shadow, in compiling it all if you took the liberty to set and adjust to a standard for the betterment of the CB and all the Datasets that you maintain.

 

[Unseelie]

Awesome thanks guys.

My only plan I can think off is after the next release to do a sort of Half-Freeze where no changes will be put in only NEW things in New .user files. This would give me the chance to spend a few weeks sorting and changing everything. I am still nervous about removing stuff but I think I have an idea on how to fix or allow a fall back maybe without breaking all the .por files.

See if I can cut out some time to do something like this.

I was thinking... I know you said previously (due to a misnamed file) that you try to avoid deletes. In a case like that one, couldn't you introduce a new, properly named, file and make use of replace thing? At least, I think it's replace thing... what lets you say "use this version instead of the existing one."

 

[ShadowChemosh]

I was thinking... I know you said previously (due to a misnamed file) that you try to avoid deletes. In a case like that one, couldn't you introduce a new, properly named, file and make use of replace thing? At least, I think it's replace thing... what lets you say "use this version instead of the existing one."

Technically I could. I would have to "Replace" every Thing in the one file with the other. Two issues with this. First for anyone looking at what I did it would be confusing. So thats bad.

The bigger reason is we try not to ever use "Replace Thing ID" in these data sets as HL currently can only handle one Replace. So this would prevent anyone else from doing their own houserules.

For example I could have houseruled changes to some Racial Specials. So I can do a "Replace Thing ID" so that monsters in the .por use my new houserule. This also means that as I didn't change the CB .user files my changes don't get removed with a new update. So thats another reason I would prefer to not use "Replace Thing ID" feature for any of our data sets if we can help it. It would break for anyone who is currently using "Replace Thing ID" and prevent someone in the future from doing their own houserules.

 

[Unseelie]

Technically I could. I would have to "Replace" every Thing in the one file with the other. Two issues with this. First for anyone looking at what I did it would be confusing. So thats bad.

The bigger reason is we try not to ever use "Replace Thing ID" in these data sets as HL currently can only handle one Replace. So this would prevent anyone else from doing their own houserules.

For example I could have houseruled changes to some Racial Specials. So I can do a "Replace Thing ID" so that monsters in the .por use my new houserule. This also means that as I didn't change the CB .user files my changes don't get removed with a new update. So thats another reason I would prefer to not use "Replace Thing ID" feature for any of our data sets if we can help it. It would break for anyone who is currently using "Replace Thing ID" and prevent someone in the future from doing their own houserules.

Thanks... answers my question and tells me more than I previously knew about Replace Thing.

 

[Unseelie]

I don't remember seeing Beholder but I will look. If I find it will have to delete it as its not OGL and very copy righted. As far as I know the only thing close is the "Eye Tyrant" or something like that from a 3PP.

So, I completely removed the community bestiary from third party updates and after a relaunch the Beholder was no longer offered for a race... so it's definitely in the Community Bestiary somewhere.

 

[Steev42]

So, I completely removed the community bestiary from third party updates and after a relaunch the Beholder was no longer offered for a race... so it's definitely in the Community Bestiary somewhere.

Specifically, it appears to be in the file PFRPG_SecondDarkness_WOC_Aberrations.user. Just to help out.

 

[Unseelie]

Specifically, it appears to be in the file PFRPG_SecondDarkness_WOC_Aberrations.user. Just to help out.

Interesting. I didn't actually have second darkness enabled...

 

[Steev42]

Well, it doesn't have any sources, so it would always be available.

Looks that that same file also has Umber Hulk and Carrion Crawler, which I believe are also product identity of WotC.

 

[ShadowChemosh]

Well, it doesn't have any sources, so it would always be available.

Looks that that same file also has Umber Hulk and Carrion Crawler, which I believe are also product identity of WotC.

Ouch that is NOT good!

Thanks for letting me know. I need to get those out then as they should not exist actually. Even Second Darkness which was done under 3.5 would not have been able to use those monsters in the AP.

 

[Lord Magus]

Ouch that is NOT good!

Thanks for letting me know. I need to get those out then as they should not exist actually. Even Second Darkness which was done under 3.5 would not have been able to use those monsters in the AP.

3 .user files hold PF conversions of 3.5 monsters, including the "closed" ones mentioned above:
PFRPG_SecondDarkness_WOC_Oozes.user (1 monster)
PFRPG_SecondDarkness_WOC_Aberrations.user (5 monsters + the second instance of the "Ranged Touch Attack" weapon)
PFRPG_SecondDarkness_WOC_Giants.user (11 monsters)

 

[ShadowChemosh]

d20pfsrd - Community Bestiary (vX.XX)
The Community has been hard at work inputting adventure path and 3PP monsters. I have combined all these different books into one large data set for the community. Inside you will find hundreds of evil creatures to torture your players with or I mean give XP too.

So after installing this data set you will have a large number of books that can be check marked in the Configure Your Hero window listed under the "Hero Lab Community" section. The adventure path monsters are all setup to work under the already included Adventure Path books. Please note that not EVERY book is fully inputted at this time.

Full Author List
Bodrin, djc664, frumple, hangarflying, Huntercc, Joey Virtue, LordMagus, Nikmal, Paris.Crenshaw, ShadowChemosh, thedarkelf007, Umarian, and ValaraukarU.

Installation Instructions
See THIS post for full details.

Additional HL Packages Required
To be able to use this data set several different official HL data sets are required. Maybe this will change in the future but for now this data set WILL NOT LOAD without these official packages. The latest packages list is: Advanced Players Guide, Bestiary 1, Bestiary 2, Bestiary 3, Ultimate Combat, and Ultimate Magic

Note: Some of the .por files may require additional packages to load correctly but they won't cause Hero Lab to fall into Safe Mode. Unfortunately at this time there is no easy method to track this so all I can do is give a warning.

Where to find the Monsters
1) Some of the monsters are included as .stock files and you find them by going to the HL Menu "Portfolio->Import Stock Hero...".
2) Do to the massive size of the .por files, 600megs as of 8/5/2012, I have stored each adventure path and module as a seperate .zip file that you can get from d20pfsrd. These are all stored in the "Community Bestiary" folder at the top.

Version Notes
v2.4 - September 18, 2012
=Frumple=
Tome of Horrors - Added A, B, C, and D monsters.
-- Not included (A): Adherer, Amphisbaena, Monadic Deva, Movanic Deca, Ant Lion, Animal Lord, Ascomoid, Atomie, Aurumvorax
-- Not Included (B): Basidirond, Mobat, Bhuta, Blindheim, Bog Mummy, Bogeyman, Brownie, Bunyip
-Updated the "Tome of Horrors" stock files A through Z.
-Added new "Tome of Horrors" stock files for: Angels, Daemons, Demons, and Devils.
-Updated AP61 Shattered Star - Shards of Sin bestiary and NPCs.
-New .por zip file for chapter 1 uploaded to d20pfsrd.

=ShadowChemosh=
-Fixed clash against Pathfinder v7.0 that was preventing the data package from loading.
"PFRPG_Tome_of_Horrors_frumple.user" made following changes:
-Removed "thingid.xImmRust" as its a duplicate of what was added officially.
-Moved other "Immune Abilities" to the "PFRPG_Bestiary_UniversialAbilities.user" so they are stored in a central place.
-Did a rename to each one to "xx" so we don't future clash with new updates.
-Fixed some sources and missing "Product Identity For".
-Moved some of the Tome of Horrors universal monster abilities over to "PFRPG_Bestiary_UniversialAbilities.user".
-Renamed "PFRG_Carrion_Crown_AP.user" to "PFRPG_Carrion_Crown_AP.user".
-Removed: PFRPG_SecondDarkness_WOC_Oozes.user; PFRPG_SecondDarkness_WOC_Giants.user; and PFRPG_SecondDarkness_WOC_Aberrations.user. As these where filled with Non-OGL monsters from 3.5 Wizards of the Coast.
-Added in my latest Adjustments file.

 

[blzbob]

So how do I get this to update? I tried to use the "View Updates" but nothing has changed for me.