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- The Lone Wolf Development Team
Kickstarter communication
- Thread starter alientude
- Start date
MaxSupernova
Well-known member
Thank you, Rob.
I'm sorry that part of the fallout has been making your medical issues more public than I'm sure you were expecting or hoping.
Thank you for the information and the assurance that things are looking up.
I'm sorry that part of the fallout has been making your medical issues more public than I'm sure you were expecting or hoping.
Thank you for the information and the assurance that things are looking up.
Good health to you. Take the time that is needed. But please, monthly updates on the KS page regardless of how much progress has been made each month. Believe it or not, we're a compassionate, very patient, supportive, passionate, smart group of people. If you keep us informed, we'll support you even though we may be frustrated, angry and annoyed. But stop abusing us. It does a disservice to you and the community.
Besides, the fact of the matter is that Pathfinder is dead, so the KS rewards are a lot less useful than they would have been if release projections had been met. I stopped posting here regularly when I realized that the only two things that drove my decision to buy a lifetime sub to RW -- Razor Coast and The Blight -- are next to useless to me.
Regular communication on KS is what I would like to see transpire with the hopes that after KS fulfillment, it's part of LWD's commitment to excellence and communication continues. Pick your main method of communication and make sure that every message is posted there. We don't want to go to Twitter, Facebook, G+, Discord, the forums or where ever else to piece together info. If you don't have staff to support multiple social media outlets, pick the one with greatest impact and stop posting to the others down so you have KS and that one.
Besides, the fact of the matter is that Pathfinder is dead, so the KS rewards are a lot less useful than they would have been if release projections had been met. I stopped posting here regularly when I realized that the only two things that drove my decision to buy a lifetime sub to RW -- Razor Coast and The Blight -- are next to useless to me.
Regular communication on KS is what I would like to see transpire with the hopes that after KS fulfillment, it's part of LWD's commitment to excellence and communication continues. Pick your main method of communication and make sure that every message is posted there. We don't want to go to Twitter, Facebook, G+, Discord, the forums or where ever else to piece together info. If you don't have staff to support multiple social media outlets, pick the one with greatest impact and stop posting to the others down so you have KS and that one.
I would not say PF1 is dead. There is an enormous amount of material available and I seriously doubt Paizo and the other companies will stop selling the PDF's any time soon. Anyone playing PF1 can certainly continue to play it from now till they stop making computers with PDF readers.
PF2 looks to be a disaster to make 4e look like a success so we may well see a PF3 that is more or less a real successor to PF1 sooner than Paizo expects. So we may just need to be patient for a couple of years as well.
PF2 looks to be a disaster to make 4e look like a success so we may well see a PF3 that is more or less a real successor to PF1 sooner than Paizo expects. So we may just need to be patient for a couple of years as well.
Maidhc O Casain
Well-known member
Yep, PF1 is the end of the line for me - I won't be picking up any future d20 fantasy game systems. And Razor Coast is very much not useless to me! I've just started running a campaign in that setting and the RW package for it will be incredibly useful to me for years to come.
OD&D isn't dead either if you mean there are people playing. Indeed, I'm one of them. PF isn't going away, but for all intents and purposes as a platform, it isn't going to get anywhere near the level of support it has enjoyed, has been bleeding both players and sales to 5e at a prodigious rate, and will become fan-supported over time to keep it going as Paizo focuses marketing effort towards its new shiny.
I've watched 3rd party vendors dumping stock like crazy. FGG sells it by the pound at cons so they can clear whatever stock they have left. And if you look at online platforms to get a sense of play or Amazon for a sense of popularity, PF isn't close to 5e. No they aren't perfect metrics, but they are useful for understanding the gaming market.
If LWD was/is betting on a big influx of PF money, they missed that boat. And Paizo missed a huge opportunity to stem off the 5e tidal wave. 20/20 hindsight.... The boat steered too slowly.
I've watched 3rd party vendors dumping stock like crazy. FGG sells it by the pound at cons so they can clear whatever stock they have left. And if you look at online platforms to get a sense of play or Amazon for a sense of popularity, PF isn't close to 5e. No they aren't perfect metrics, but they are useful for understanding the gaming market.
If LWD was/is betting on a big influx of PF money, they missed that boat. And Paizo missed a huge opportunity to stem off the 5e tidal wave. 20/20 hindsight.... The boat steered too slowly.
5e definitely benefited from the back to basics thing as well as the nameplate. I'm sure even 4e had sales throughout its run from people entering the TT RPG hobby.
When a new player walks into a game store looking for an organized play group they are far more likely to join DDAL simply because they know the name rather than PFS. Which is what is killing PFS and leading to the death of PF overall. Back in the days of 4e DDAL was not a factor there were no groups, at least not anywhere I heard about, so all the new players got funneled into PFS.
4th Edition had Living Forgotten Realms, which (IIRC) had some popularity around here. I didn't play 4e, though I still have the main books somewhere.
Both PFS and D&D AL are going well here. I expect AL is gaining players and PFS/SFS/ACG/PFS2 Playtest are slowly losing them along with the splintering.
Regular updates of some kind are good, and I would prefer if they weren't primarily on social media. I don't think they need to do monthly Kickstarter posts of "nothing's changed, see you in 30 days" though; that just becomes noise and makes it more likely you won't pay attention when something does change.
Both PFS and D&D AL are going well here. I expect AL is gaining players and PFS/SFS/ACG/PFS2 Playtest are slowly losing them along with the splintering.
Regular updates of some kind are good, and I would prefer if they weren't primarily on social media. I don't think they need to do monthly Kickstarter posts of "nothing's changed, see you in 30 days" though; that just becomes noise and makes it more likely you won't pay attention when something does change.
Chicago's main PFS location for PFS basically got wiped while DDAL at the same location on the same night went from nothing to 10 or 12 tables in the course of about 2 years.
Some of that was the store clerks steering no players to DDAL, some of that was people simply be more familiar with D&D as a brand and some of that was some very toxic players in the local PFS groups. Our local venture officers were some of the least competent organizers and managers of an organization I've ever dealt with. We had 2 people who have been banned or kicked out of multiple gaming groups, including my own home game and several other home games that I'm aware of. They claimed that the store forbid them from banning them. When it got the point that the PFS tables weren't making they tried joining the DDAL tables. The DDAL organizer straight told them in front of numerous people they were not welcome and he would cancel any signup they made on warhorn in the future. The store said not a word.
As to updates, regular updates, as long as they are honest, even of the we have nothing substantially new to report means that that they are at least still devoting some time and effort on us. The situation from the spring and early summer made a lot of people very angry. It wasn't just the complete radio silence. It was bug reports that simply vanished into a black hole not even the automated reply that it had been received, I personally sent in at least a dozen from when I was working on the community realm that simply went into the void. It was the multi months long stall waiting for Paizo without any other patches. No one can tell that time was well spent. Rob was ill, I understand and accept that. Whatever other developers were working on RW should have accepted that they were pounding their heads against a brick wall and directed their efforts instead at bug fixes and minor feature updates until Paizo delivered from their end. A couple of QoL and bug fix patches would have made the entire community so happy that there is no way we'd where we are now.
And no, they definitely should not be on FB or twitter. I have a FB account that I only use for business purposes. I keep my personal life off FB and increasingly everyone I know does as well. I've never used twitter. The only person I know who ever uses twitter is my company's social media rep. This forum is advertised as LWD's official presence on the web so the should post any updates here or through email. They went to the effort of harvesting all of our emails after all.
Some of that was the store clerks steering no players to DDAL, some of that was people simply be more familiar with D&D as a brand and some of that was some very toxic players in the local PFS groups. Our local venture officers were some of the least competent organizers and managers of an organization I've ever dealt with. We had 2 people who have been banned or kicked out of multiple gaming groups, including my own home game and several other home games that I'm aware of. They claimed that the store forbid them from banning them. When it got the point that the PFS tables weren't making they tried joining the DDAL tables. The DDAL organizer straight told them in front of numerous people they were not welcome and he would cancel any signup they made on warhorn in the future. The store said not a word.
As to updates, regular updates, as long as they are honest, even of the we have nothing substantially new to report means that that they are at least still devoting some time and effort on us. The situation from the spring and early summer made a lot of people very angry. It wasn't just the complete radio silence. It was bug reports that simply vanished into a black hole not even the automated reply that it had been received, I personally sent in at least a dozen from when I was working on the community realm that simply went into the void. It was the multi months long stall waiting for Paizo without any other patches. No one can tell that time was well spent. Rob was ill, I understand and accept that. Whatever other developers were working on RW should have accepted that they were pounding their heads against a brick wall and directed their efforts instead at bug fixes and minor feature updates until Paizo delivered from their end. A couple of QoL and bug fix patches would have made the entire community so happy that there is no way we'd where we are now.
And no, they definitely should not be on FB or twitter. I have a FB account that I only use for business purposes. I keep my personal life off FB and increasingly everyone I know does as well. I've never used twitter. The only person I know who ever uses twitter is my company's social media rep. This forum is advertised as LWD's official presence on the web so the should post any updates here or through email. They went to the effort of harvesting all of our emails after all.
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Happydevil43
Well-known member
I have been following the playtest quite closely even though our group has decided to stay on PF1.
pF2 is a small step in the direction to stem the tide against 5e, but it’s not there yet, and may never do as they have tweaked a lot of stuff but it hasn’t gone far enough and have introduced mechanics that haven’t balanced well.... but I digress.
Our group has being playing 5e and we like it, it’s just a tad too basic for us so remaining on pf1 for now. We worked out that if we played every AP at our current rate, will be all long and turned to dust or at least senility has kicked in, and we can play them over again, before we have played them all (about 30 years at last count)... so the old grey mare has a bit of life in her yet.
So please put the PF1 content in... all of it... I may sway the other GMs in our group to the dark side
23 at least announced PF1 AP's. I'm guessing considering Return of the Runelords ends in 7 months that the first PF2 AP will start then with ReturnotRL serving as the capstone of the PF1 AP's.
I've run RotRL several times and I cannot imagine it taking less than a year to complete unless you go for marathon 8 or 10 hour game sessions. The same goes for all the AP's I'm familiar enough with to run, Skull and Shackles, Jade Regent, Wrath of the Righteous and Giantslayer, which I'm guessing means they all are about the same length.
So that's more than enough published material to last any GM for a lifetime.
I've run RotRL several times and I cannot imagine it taking less than a year to complete unless you go for marathon 8 or 10 hour game sessions. The same goes for all the AP's I'm familiar enough with to run, Skull and Shackles, Jade Regent, Wrath of the Righteous and Giantslayer, which I'm guessing means they all are about the same length.
So that's more than enough published material to last any GM for a lifetime.
Happydevil43
Well-known member
We take about 1.5 to 2 years to finish an AP. We never finished ROTRL, which I would like to go back and do, but everybody still remembers everything, so we need to wait till old age creeps in
We have played Mummy's Mask and Shatter Star and Giant Slayer in the past 4 years.... so we should all be gaming round the nursing home for many years to come, and still arguing about the Grapple Rule.
Happydevil43
Well-known member
Yup.
The killer for us was resonance - Level+Cha bonus and need to use one everytime you drank a potion or used a wand.... There is hope that things will change before final printing, but I doubt it.
Wait for the new rulebook Pathfinder 2nd edition - Fixes for all the things we ****ked up on.
Nope. They quite proudly announced that there were no reports of problems with resonance from the phase 1 playtest, despite the forum being full of such.
I imagine that soon enough FGG or someone like that will release a real spiritual successor to PF1 as Paizo released the real spiritual successor to D&D 3.5 and Paizo will quietly either fix their problems or go the that great game design studio in the sky.
I imagine that soon enough FGG or someone like that will release a real spiritual successor to PF1 as Paizo released the real spiritual successor to D&D 3.5 and Paizo will quietly either fix their problems or go the that great game design studio in the sky.
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Mystic Lemur
Well-known member
Maybe the people in those forum posts didn't bother to do the survey?
MaxSupernova
Well-known member
What?!?!
No company would choose its priorities by using the results of a broad survey rather than the dedicated users in their forums.
That's absurd!
No company would choose its priorities by using the results of a broad survey rather than the dedicated users in their forums.
That's absurd!