Gestalt - Community Package....

[Ualaa]

Is there an equivalent to the Player Pack, for the d20 System?
Or someone who has done content shared with the community?

If so, that would be your best bet.

Either that, or dive into the world of the Hero Lab Editor.
Generally people suggest finding something similar and copying that mechanic.
I could be recalling wrong, but are there classes like Mystic Theurge/Ur-Priest for 3.5, where your one level advances features from more than one class?
Something like that, might be the basis for copying the mechanic.

Probably not easy or fast.

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A quicker way to do it, may be to simply take levels in both classes on top of each other.

With gestalt, it is suggested that you use fractional BAB, fractional Saves, and best progression for features that both sides of the gestalt share.
As per the side bar, within the Gestalt rules section of the Unearthed Arcana 3.0 book.

For fractional BAB, compare your two classes.
If either has full BAB (+20 to hit, at 20th level) advance your BAB by +1.00 for that level.
If either has 3/4 BAB as the better of the two classes (so +15 to hit, at 20th level), then advance your BAB by +0.75, for that level.
If both classes of the Gestalt only have 1/2 BAB (so +10 to hit, at 20th level), then advance your BAB by +0.50, for that level.

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With fractional saves...
If either of your level one classes has strong saves +2 at first level... then they effectively have +2.5 (which on the 1/12th's scale is 30/12).
If between both of your classes, at first level your saves are poor (+0), then you effectively have (on the 1/12th's scale 4/12).

After first level, every time your character levels up, compare both classes.
If the saving throw is a good progression for that character, then advance that saving throw by +6/12th's.
If both sides of the gestalt have a poor progression for that specific save, then advance it by +4/12th's.

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Best progression of abilities is basically Rogue sneak dice.
The rogue gains +1d6 sneak, at every odd level, and eventually hits +10d6 sneak dice at 19th character level.
If you find a class that also adds sneak dice, your character cannot have a better progression than the better of the two progressions.

In Pathfinder a rogue gains +1d6 (per two levels).
And in Pathfinder a slayer gains +1d6 (per three levels).
No matter how you stagger your levels, so 1d6 is gained as often as possible...
The better progression of the Rogue... with 1d6 per odd level means that at 9th level the character cannot have more than 5d6 sneak dice.
So a Rogue 10 | Slayer 10 has 5d6 sneak, not 5d6 from Rogue and 3d6 from Slayer for 8d6 total.

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If you were to just add class levels, so if your desired Gestalt was Druid | Rogue.
At first level take Druid 1 and Rogue 1, being a 2nd level character as far as Hero Lab is concerned...

With fractional BAB, your character should be +0.75 (rounded down to +0, but record 0.75 somewhere)... and give yourself +2.5 (30/12) to each save, as the Druid has strong Fort/Will, while the Rogue has strong Ref.

For other features there isn't overlap.

The rogue has 8+INT skills, which is superior to the druid's.
The rogue has +1d6 sneak attack, and gains Trap Finding etc.
The druid has spellcasting as a first level druid.

For hit points, your character should have 8 (maxed at first level), plus (or minus) CON modifier.

Having given your character both a Rogue and a Druid level, you'll likely have too high in a few things... BAB, Saves, Hit Points, Skill Points (max skill ranks).

But you can adjust those, via adjustments.
And reduce your Gestalted character to the value that they should actually have.

So total BAB is +0.75. Fort/Ref/Will are all +2.50. Hit Points are 8+CON. Max ranks in a skill is 1, with 8+INT total skill ranks.
Adjust your numbers manually.

You'll have the features of both classes, because you physically added both within HL.

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I don't possess ranks in Editor-fu, but that's how I would achieve Gestalt in Hero Lab, lacking a Gestalt package to utilize.

 

[wdmartin]

Public Service Advisory! If you receive the following error:

WARNING!

Unrecoverable infinite loop detected and broken. Portfolio evaluation aborted and current state is unknown.

Cause of infinite loop is inappropriate dependencies based on the use of global tags.

Please notify data file author to correct problem.

It means that you have added a level of Gestalt before adding the two classes that are meant to be combined. Delete the Gestalt level and add your other classes first.

This took me by surprise; it's been a while since I last statted up a gestalt PC, and in older versions of the gestalt package, you explicitly had to add the level of gestalt first. That has, it seems, changed.

 

[direinsomniac]

There seems to be an issue with the Gestalt pack and the kineticist.
I am making a character that that has a couple of gestalt levels and then multiclasses into Kineticist.

No matter what order I add the classes, (kineticist first, then gestalt A/B or vice versa) I get errors on the kineticist class to where all of the level-dependant class abilities flag errors for improper level.

For example; I am a lvl 7 kineticist, lvl 3 gestalt druid/sorcerer. As soon as I add in the gestalt class picker to merge the druid and sorc level, my Expanded Element Focus (gained at level 7) shows that I need to be level 7 to select.


**Update** Using the Kineticist class as one of the 2 gestalted classes seems to work fine; no validation errors. It seems to just do this when you try to use gestalt and multiclass kineticist.

 

[wdmartin]

Weird error here. We're six levels into the campaign, and the GM has just retroactively gestalt levels to my level 6 sorceress. In order to accomplish this, I did the following:

1. Created a new portfolio
2. Used Import Hero from Portfolio to copy the PC in.
3. Deleted five levels of sorcerer, retaining only the first level
4. Added a level of paladin
5. Added the gestalt level
6. Used the selectors to pick Sorcerer/Paladin.
7. Added the next level of each, repeat.

I basically went through one level at a time.

I'm straight sorcerer on one side, and on the other I'm taking 2 levels of Paladin and 4 levels of Unchained Monk with a custom archetype called Twiliminal that makes most monk abilities key off Charisma. It's closely patterned off the Scaled Fist archetype, only fey themed.

Anyway, everything worked! I got all my class levels added, boggled at my new stats for a while, then saved the file and went to bed.

When I next opened it -- in a different copy of HL, I should add, using one of my secondary licenses -- the list of classes looked like this:

And the class selectors on the Gestalt tab looked like this:

It looks like it's somehow forgotten my first two levels? I guess? I have six levels worth of gestalt selectors filled in, only now there are two levels at the beginning with nothing selected because there's nothing to select.

I'm on version 1.1 of the gestalt pack, and there's a crap ton of homebrew going on in there. We're using the World is Square feat tax rules, plus some custom traits, a custom alternate racial trait, a custom archetype for the monk levels, and a custom feat.

It's weird that it worked fine at home but not at work (where I do PbP games during lunch). I'm going to double check to see that both copies are running the same versions of everything. I mean, they should be. But something is clearly out of whack, and that's the first thing that jumps to mind.

 

[wdmartin]

Aaand, it was totally a version problem. I had Gestalt 0.6 installed at home, and Gestalt 1.1 installed at work. All it took was updating the gestalt package.

And redoing the PC, again. But at least it wasn't a difficult fix.

 

[firefly44]

Gestalt Class select not working

Hi, I just installed the current Gestalt pack. I am making a Gestalt Paladin 5/Fighter 5. I add the 5 levels of Gestalt, and I go to the Gestalt tab to pick the classes, but the drop downs for adding class 1 & class 2 at each level offer no choices. This is the case on iPad and desktop. I tried just adding one level of Gestalt to start, and it was the same thing. I tried reinstalling HeroLab and it didn't work. Anyone else having this issue? Any suggestions?

 

[GrinningJest3r]

Firefly, have you also added the specific class levels? You need 5 levels of gestalt, 5 levels of paladin, and 5 levels of fighter. Then the dropdown in the gestalt will let you select the levels you want to mix.

 

[Tarmor]

Hi, I just installed the current Gestalt pack. I am making a Gestalt Paladin 5/Fighter 5. I add the 5 levels of Gestalt, and I go to the Gestalt tab to pick the classes, but the drop downs for adding class 1 & class 2 at each level offer no choices. This is the case on iPad and desktop. I tried just adding one level of Gestalt to start, and it was the same thing. I tried reinstalling HeroLab and it didn't work. Anyone else having this issue? Any suggestions?

Did you read the instructions on how to use the Gestalt package? Take a look at the very 1st post in this thread. If you still have problems after that, then tell us what you have done and what doesn't seem to be working. Firefly has given you the basics - don't just add Gestalt levels!

 

[Ualaa]

As the two previous posts to this have said...

Add your level in Gestalt.
In the same place where you added that, also add Paladin and Fighter.
Now you have three classes all listed where you'd normally do classes for a single character.

Then you go to the Gestalt tab and add both Paladin and Fighter, from the aforementioned empty drop down options.
They won't be empty once you've added classes beyond the Gestalt, on the classes tab.

 

[Senko]

Don't know if this is still being maintained but gestalt doesn't seem to work if you make multiple heroes in the same portfolio.

For one hero it works perfectly but when you create a second in the same portfolio it starts generating an error message you don't have enough xp.

 

[Dwayne]

Don't know if this is still being maintained but gestalt doesn't seem to work if you make multiple heroes in the same portfolio.

For one hero it works perfectly but when you create a second in the same portfolio it starts generating an error message you don't have enough xp.

Try using the option for no xp required to level.

 

[Senko]

I suppose that works just seemed like a bug you need to do that with multiple heroes but not for single ones.

 

[Totino]

Just started playing in a Gestalt game, and I'm loving having Hero Lab support it, most of it seems to work great but there's one outstanding issue that I'm having, and it's that the character level is reports as triple the character's actual level. It makes sense, since you have to pick Gestalt + Class 1 + Class 2 for each level, but is there an adjustment or way to fix it for calculations based on that level, like XP and such? Basically need a way to add a class level to a character that doesn't "count" I guess?

 

[Ualaa]

You can adjust CR with an adjustment.
I think that is either in the Community Package or right in Hero Lab.

As far as level calculations, almost everything is going to scale off of class level not total levels.
If you're using Spheres of Might or Ultimate Spheres of Power, where it scales off BAB or combined Caster Level, there are adjustments for both of those.

 

[Vigoroso]

I have downloaded and imported the file per the instructions over five times, reactivated my license, restarted several times to know avail. The files are on my computer but won't load in my Herolab. Help.

 

[Maidhc O Casain]

Have you gone into the Configure Hero tab and made sure the source is there and activated (the check box is clicked)?

 

[Rhyus]

The group I game with for the past many years with Pathfinder has always used Gestalt characters because it allowed us to play every weekend whether people were missing or not. I have created a character in the past that was a Warlord and I had issues with the Warlord Maneuvers. It seemed like it could not calculate what actual level it was to allow the selection of the maneuvers. I also have on this new character a Psion. It might be having issues calculating the hitpoints that have been boosted because of the powers it chooses along with other options. I have included my saved 15th level character to this post. I had to actually go and create a single class Warlord to be able to give me the correct selection of Maneuvers that I then selected for this character. I hope you can figure out what is wrong and maybe put a fix out for it.

 

[Alyindar]

Don't know if this is still being maintained but gestalt doesn't seem to work if you make multiple heroes in the same portfolio.

For one hero it works perfectly but when you create a second in the same portfolio it starts generating an error message you don't have enough xp.

I can reproduce this but also find a way to make it "go away". It seems to be the way Hero Lab processes the order of calculating xp to level. Here's what I do to make the error message and validation flag go away:
- Level up, adding the Gestalt class and the two classes you are leveling.
- Go to the Gestalt tab and assign the classes like described in the initial posts.
- Save the portfolio, then open it again.

This seems to prompt Hero Lab to recalculate xp needed correctly with the Gestalt class, although some actions like adding xp in the journal will reissue the error flags, so just save and reopen again.

 

[Dwayne]

I am not sure if this is still being worked on but I have a few bug reports. I noticed that if you add a barbarian (unchained) it changes all the previous hp to d12. Also the Oracle's curse level is not correct. I believe it is adding all the classes together for the curse. I also noticed that the Shaman has many problems. It has been some time but I think the problems were familiar level, saves, and hexes.

 

[Ualaa]

I don't think the Community Package has been maintained since ShadowChemosh departed.

For Gestalt it counts the Gestalt selector, plus both the first and second classes you pick i the drop down. So each level your character gains counts as three levels. If one side is an actual Oracle (or in my case a Path of War class) it counts as a full level plus two half levels (the other class you select, plus the Gestalt class you choose to get the selector in the first place).

My best work around for Gestalt was to not use the package when choosing classes. I still have the package installed and active because it has useful adjustments.

If someone takes Ranger plus Wizard, I check the BAB and on the levels where Wizard adds a BAB and takes the gestalt beyond 1 BAB per level, I adjust the BAB downwards by one.

I've always used "Fractional BAB" and "Fractional Saves", as presented in the sidebar of the 3.0 Unearthed Arcana, which is the first time I recall seeing the option. With that option, your level 1 classes (not the first level taken in a class) each give 2.50 if it is a good save or 0.33 if it a poor save. Thereafter good classes always add +0.50 and poor classes always add +0.33 to saving throws, even if it is the first level taken in a class (which normally grant higher bonuses).

The gestalt package has some Gestalt adjustments. If on the adjust tab you search for Gestalt, you'll find Gestalt BAB and Gestalt Saves. You can use a dropdown for the saves to choose whether it is for Fort, Ref, Will or All saves. I generally add four adjustments to every gestalt character, BAB, Fort, Ref, and Will.

That is then less broken for things that are scripted off of total levels, but I still have to manually check for every level up.

It is a fun option, but not an easy one to implement. In the current game my characters are Gestalt 20s, with some being two classes at 20 each and others being one class at 20 and up to three classes that together add to 20 levels on the second side of the build.