New update - v3.98 (beta)

[Duggan]

Or am I off base here? Could the feature still use some improvement? I want to include it to help the newbies, but not at the cost of annoying everyone else. Let me know what you think!

I like the more low-key message. I think, however that at least for the attacks, it would make more sense to see it on the Special tab where you can see the attack bonus and save DC of each of your powers.

One other minor thing I forgot to mention before, but currently, the PL tracking operates on one's current state, so someone turning on their Growth or Shrinking is likely to get messages either saying they've exceeded caps or aren't meeting them. I seem to remember that when a Hero was fatigued, I was also getting messages about not meeting caps since my attack values (and strength bonus) went down.

 

[Colen]

Perhaps the wording could be changed. Right now it gives the impression that one MUST meet the caps. Maybe change it to two separate messages, one keyed to attack and one keyed to defense, that would show up as appropriate and say "Your (Attack) Bonus is below the PL limit. Increasing it by ( X value ) is permissible."

Just my two cents worth.

That's a good idea. I'l change it to say:

Consider boosting the ranks of these powers and traits:
Toughness save / Defense (by up to 5); Attack bonus / save DC (by up to 2)​

That way it's clearer that it's not a requirement. There'll also be a tooltip with hopefully helpful info when you mouse over it.

Duggan: I can't think of a great way to handle that right now; hopefully it won't be as much of a pain with this version, since the message won't appear as big red validation messages. I'll put it on the to-do list, maybe I can come up with a better way of doing it later.

Thanks for your feedback on this - I'll release another beta in the next day or two which should have fixes for the most important problems that people reported (mostly those involving validation errors appearing incorrectly, or power costs being calculated incorrectly.)

 

[Shadowchaser]

That's a good idea. I'l change it to say:

Consider boosting the ranks of these powers and traits:
Toughness save / Defense (by up to 5); Attack bonus / save DC (by up to 2)​

That way it's clearer that it's not a requirement. There'll also be a tooltip with hopefully helpful info when you mouse over it.

Duggan: I can't think of a great way to handle that right now; hopefully it won't be as much of a pain with this version, since the message won't appear as big red validation messages. I'll put it on the to-do list, maybe I can come up with a better way of doing it later.

Thanks for your feedback on this - I'll release another beta in the next day or two which should have fixes for the most important problems that people reported (mostly those involving validation errors appearing incorrectly, or power costs being calculated incorrectly.)

These all sound like good suggestions, but I'd still like to see the message defaulted to 'Off'. I'd suggest to put the tick box for turning it on near the top of the rules list, in a section called 'Creation Assitance Guidelines' or something.

 

[Duggan]

These all sound like good suggestions, but I'd still like to see the message defaulted to 'Off'. I'd suggest to put the tick box for turning it on near the top of the rules list, in a section called 'Creation Assitance Guidelines' or something.

Or perhaps if there were an easy way to set it as "off" once rather than having to do it for every character in the past... it would probbaly default as On so as to catch the newbies. ^_^

 

[Shadowchaser]

Or perhaps if there were an easy way to set it as "off" once rather than having to do it for every character in the past... it would probbaly default as On so as to catch the newbies. ^_^

I'm kinda wanting it to NOT catch the newbies, really. Mini-maxing is a choice, but it shouldn't be something the program steers you towards. The more I think about it, the more I think the program shouldn't make this suggestion at all. If the game were set up like True 20, where you defaulted to certain numbers, that would be one thing... but this game can quickly be destroyed if all you think about is 'Hitting your caps' when building a character.

I really don't like this feature. I know it can be useful to people who are building combat machines, but for those of us who are trying to stress the role-playing aspects of the game, it can really build bad habits among your players.

I really don't want this to default to the 'On' position. But, again, I'm just one voice in a crowd, here, and I'll accept the majority rule.

 

[atlarman]

I agree with chaser here but the re-wording of the message is a good compromise. anything so it doesn't register as a violation, since capping is a choice really. in my personal xp, its USUALLY a better OPTION CHARACTER WISE to leave some room on uyour combat bonuses in favor of taking concept friendly feats to give some edge.
As for catching 'newbies', it's also my xp that most of the time they really dont need to be "reminded" to optimize/maximize their bonues- especially when it comes to combat! lol IF ANYTHING, as a GM, MORE OF MY TIME IS TAKEN UP TRYING TO DIS SWAY NEWBIES FROM DOING THIS BLATANTLY at the expense of either campaign balance and or character concept.

 

[Colen]

Or perhaps if there were an easy way to set it as "off" once rather than having to do it for every character in the past... it would probbaly default as On so as to catch the newbies. ^_^

On the settings form, turn it off, then click "Set Defaults". Hero Lab will now remember the setting for each new character.

 

[Duggan]

I figured that one as much. It's the 30+ characters I already have statted... but with it turning into the mild warning, not so much a problem for me.

 

[Nigel Fogg The Wayfarer]

I figured that one as much. It's the 30+ characters I already have statted... but with it turning into the mild warning, not so much a problem for me.

You mean: "helpful advisory/reminder" not "warning" right?

Nigel Fogg, aka The Wayfarer

 

[Nigel Fogg The Wayfarer]

New question:

I have a character with the Rank 12 Trip Power and the sheet is showing a DC of 22.

Pg 93 of U.P. states that if I hit my target, the target makes a STR or DEX check vs my Power Check.

In other words, vs the sum of d20+rank [and if I have Improved Trip (as either a Power Feat or a Character Feat), +4 (if tripping in melee) or +2 (if tripping at range) on top of that].

So shouldn't that DC be a star (to represent that it's variable) not a flat 22?

Nigel Fogg, aka The Wayfarer

 

[Colen]

I figured that one as much. It's the 30+ characters I already have statted... but with it turning into the mild warning, not so much a problem for me.

As long as you haven't saved the characters since 3.98 came out, I *think* they'll obey any new default you set the next time you load them. So if you set the default now, any old characters should pick it up.

 

[Colen]

I have a character with the Rank 12 Trip Power and the sheet is showing a DC of 22.

Pg 93 of U.P. states that if I hit my target, the target makes a STR or DEX check vs my Power Check.

In other words, vs the sum of d20+rank [and if I have Improved Trip (as either a Power Feat or a Character Feat), +4 (if tripping in melee) or +2 (if tripping at range) on top of that].

So shouldn't that DC be a star (to represent that it's variable) not a flat 22?

Hmm... wouldn't it mean that there shouldn't be a DC at all? Since all you do is roll (d20 + power rank), and your opponent rolls against that. The only fixed number involved is the power rank, which we already show on the sheet, so showing a DC isn't helpful?

 

[Nigel Fogg The Wayfarer]

Hmm... wouldn't it mean that there shouldn't be a DC at all? Since all you do is roll (d20 + power rank), and your opponent rolls against that. The only fixed number involved is the power rank, which we already show on the sheet, so showing a DC isn't helpful?

No it's really not helping since it doesn't factor in at all. If you beat your target's DEF you've hit him & then it's a d20 roll + appropriate Ability Bonus vs the result of your Power Check.

I thought you were using a "star" to represent when the "number to beat" is variable, since that same sheet also shows this: (see attached jpeg) even though I'm not sure why it's not pulling the DC 25 that shows up with power description elsewhere on the sheet.

 

[atlarman]

new question here...
Hey guys, doesnt the M&M game have a limit to power rank based on campain PL? same question w/ feats-or does it just assume that point cost and allotment take care of this automatically?(page ref w/ any awswer is most apreciated) yes i am aware that HL offers you the ability to customize these limits...I just wanted a refresher on what the game assumes....(when i hit game defaults...I swearr that no limit on power ranks or number of feats is selected....but im almost sure the game assumes some sort of limit on them)maybe ive just been crunching the numbers too long.

 

[Duggan]

The only limit is on Save DC (Toughness or exotics). If the ranks would take you over PL (with adjustment for tradeoffs), you can't buy it even to sandbag. Otherwise, the sky's the limit. A Character with Speed 50, Super-Strength 25, and Teleport 25 is perfectly legal if your GM is fine with it.

 

[atlarman]

ok thanks Duggan gee now dont feel quite as bad about my character who ended up w super senses 23! campagn 10(gm removed pp limits...but somehow, I still kept having it in my head power rank shouldnt exceed PL OR PL +5! gM S NOT SAYIMG ANYTHING but guess i somehow felt bad. haha guess i been crunching numbers too long!,

 

[Nigel Fogg The Wayfarer]

new question here...
Hey guys, doesnt the M&M game have a limit to power rank based on campain PL? same question w/ feats-or does it just assume that point cost and allotment take care of this automatically?(page ref w/ any awswer is most apreciated) yes i am aware that HL offers you the ability to customize these limits...I just wanted a refresher on what the game assumes....(when i hit game defaults...I swearr that no limit on power ranks or number of feats is selected....but im almost sure the game assumes some sort of limit on them)maybe ive just been crunching the numbers too long.

Page 25 of M&M shows the maximum modifier to the Save DC a power can have. That "plus" is normally equal to the rank a power would be at but I'm sure things like Power Attack can throw off that direct one-to-one relationship.

Power Feats and Character Feats are to be watched by the GM to make sure folks don't get too silly with it. I believe there is more on this in the Mastermind's Manual but I am not as familiar with that book.

Nigel Fogg, aka The Wayfarer

 

[Nigel Fogg The Wayfarer]

ok thanks Duggan gee now dont feel quite as bad about my character who ended up w super senses 23! campagn 10(gm removed pp limits...but somehow, I still kept having it in my head power rank shouldnt exceed PL OR PL +5! gM S NOT SAYIMG ANYTHING but guess i somehow felt bad. haha guess i been crunching numbers too long!,

Well the important part of Duggan's comment is "if the GM approves." lol I know in our group you can't have anything ranked in excess of the PL. We tried a House Rule allowing you to have PL+2 in one power that was your shtick but that got messy and caused some hard feelings.

In fact, I thought about showing our GM your earlier E-Mail about being in a game that didn't track Power Points just to see his head explode.

Anyway, the Super Senses is a good point. HL lumps them all together and the last "season" of games we didn't put the PL cap against that but this "season" we are to keep folks from going nuts by taking every sense, ranged, extended, acute, accurate & analyzing.

Nigel Fogg, aka The Wayfarer

 

[Woodclaw]

Another Container bug I met today

If I activate a container with some Enhaced trait inside the cost od the traits is added another time to the hero total cost. I met a similar effect with alternate forms, but only if I increase the rank of certain feats (like Evasion).

 

[Colen]

Woodclaw: Can you email me a hero that exhibits the problem with Alternate Forms? I'm going to release a new beta version that fixes this, but I'd like to make sure it's fixed before I do. (colen@wolflair.com)

Thanks!