I don't fund Kickstarters expecting anything. If it doesn't get done, oh well no big deal. If it does, win win! But I usually don't back for over $100.
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- The Lone Wolf Development Team
Hero Lab Online FAQ
- Thread starter BJ
- Start date
I don't fund Kickstarters expecting anything. If it doesn't get done, oh well no big deal. If it does, win win! But I usually don't back for over $100.
I back way too much. The biggest one I have backed so far came in just under a grand. But so far I've had positive returns on everything. Except one computer game that failed to reach it's target. I was willing to break my rule for a remake of Sim Ant.
https://www.kickstarter.com/profile/289462234
https://www.kickstarter.com/profile/289462234
That's generally my rule, too. I invest in things I'd like to see, but I treat it as an investment. Sometimes, investments don't turn out.
That's why I don't invest more than I can lose. I think I've only gone past the $100 mark once. But, I think I've only ever had one (not the same one) investment totally fail. In that, I've been very lucky.I'm not so sure about that. Who's going to buy HLO that doesn't already own Classic? The new features are not groundbreaking enough that people who were on the fence about Hero Lab are going to be convinced to buy it now. Nobody is comfortable with the risk of spotty internet and the chances of ALL players at the table owning HLO to even make use of the features is low.
People that want Starfinder would have spent the same money for the classic version.
People who already own HL "might" convert to HLO but the cost (and profit) is minimal.
I don't think its a terrible idea, its probably not going to lose money, but I don't think its going to get new customers.
Edit: and if I was a RW customer I'd be pretty upset. Finishing RW would get me to buy in and they'd get more money from me for that than converting to HLO.
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DeltaMasterMind
Well-known member
Well as I do believe that the marketing for Realm Works should be further built up to increase revenue, there path to HLO with Star Finder just coming out is a business strategy to further strengthen there financial standing. Honestly though I have seen adverts for Herolab for some time, but rarely any adverts for Realm Works and getting more sales there needs to be given a boost. Although I don't really understand Realm Works interface well, mainly do to the fact I have no prior experience working with realm building software (if any others exist).
Plus any tutorial video I have seen on it makes me sleepy. Which sadly makes this difficult for me to gasp the software. Herolab though I get and have had time to code in it, even applying that knowledge to d20 and 5e. I am hoping for a better API and UI update to Realm Works (which I guess is in the works from what I have read thus far) and with HLO perhaps a possible Dynamic Map tool that uses Realm Works files and imports them for active use with HLO?! That would be a new thing that would get alot of customers, since that would allow for interesting convention events; let alone local play.
Plus any tutorial video I have seen on it makes me sleepy. Which sadly makes this difficult for me to gasp the software. Herolab though I get and have had time to code in it, even applying that knowledge to d20 and 5e. I am hoping for a better API and UI update to Realm Works (which I guess is in the works from what I have read thus far) and with HLO perhaps a possible Dynamic Map tool that uses Realm Works files and imports them for active use with HLO?! That would be a new thing that would get alot of customers, since that would allow for interesting convention events; let alone local play.
MNBlockHead
Well-known member
The proof will be in the pudding. When it is first released, I probably won't buy in as I'm only running and playing 5e and the new Paranoia (plus the occasional one-shot of highly obscure games that would not benefit from HL). But if they can offer the ability to have all my players' character sheets sync'd up with the tactical console on my tablet laptop and if they improved the tactical console to automate more of the condition tracking, and if it worked with the SRD, I would be all over that. I would buy for myself and my players and pay for the subscription. And that is after already plunking down a lot of money for DnD Beyond.
As for what I've spent on HL Classic, I don't mind the sunk cost if the new product is superior. It is easy for me to say that because, unlike many Pathfinder players/DMs here, I have not spent *that* much on HLC. That said, HLC will continue to be supported for some time and your content that you buy/bought for HLC will (eventually) be on HLO.
Of course, a lot of this isn't going to be ready at launch. I expect their focus is to take advantage of the popularity of Starfinder. If they offer a compelling platform for Starfinder, that should bring in a lot of new customers and convince many current customers to buy, which will fund further development.
As for upsetting RW customers, it is only really upsetting the KS backers. I bought RW for what it was and it serves me well. This is the risk with KS. If you don't have the appetite for scope and schedule changes, don't buy it until it is released and you can verify that it has the features you need.
I spend far too much money on KS. Most of my tabletop hobby spend is done through KS. I know the risk and I've been burned, but I get early access to some great products that may never see wide commercial release and often there are some amazing deals. I find it best to just ignore the comments, skim the updates when they come to my e-mail, and just wait for the backerkit or other fulfillment communication. If fulfillment never happens or the product isn't quite what I was hoping for? Ah well, a bad bet.
talsharien
Well-known member
Any updates on a release schedule?
It's not that unique, you can easily make it for the classic version. PCGen put out a character generator with a print option in their spare time for free, For Free!!! And for an alpha release, it's pretty solid.
I like Hero Labs over PCGen because it is a better piece of software(also more expensive), but seeing if my internet goes out or whatever I can't use one but I can use the other, the other wins.
Make Starfinder for Hero Labs Classic or have some sort of Offline version and print option. You have lots of people willing to throw money at you, just read the posts and comments, it'll be worth your time.
I would love Starfinder support. I would pay for Starginder for HLC.
I will not even consider HLO for many reasons.
I am fine with that decision.
I suspect people who require offline capability are now the minority in the greater RPG market.
I suspect HLC is stopping LWD from moving forward with technology and customer market share.
I suspect we will see alot of new happy customers around these parts once HLO launches.
I suspect quite a few people who are expressing significant concern now will still try HLO and find it to be useful enough to consider purchasing.
The same way DnDBeyond had pages upon pages of raging complaints about basically the same concerns, they also had significant success upon launch and now have a solid customer base.
I suspect HLC is stopping LWD from moving forward with technology and customer market share.
I suspect we will see alot of new happy customers around these parts once HLO launches.
I suspect quite a few people who are expressing significant concern now will still try HLO and find it to be useful enough to consider purchasing.
The same way DnDBeyond had pages upon pages of raging complaints about basically the same concerns, they also had significant success upon launch and now have a solid customer base.
This!
All the complaints about edge cases, like losing internet. In the last decade the only time my internet went out was when my modem died. Heck, had a severe storm and lost power for a week, still had cable tv and internet, luckily I had a generator.
LWD needs to move forward and unconnected desktop apps are becoming a relic of the past
Well, true. This is also a very short summary of Rob's long explanary post in the Q&A thread
I am definitely in the "significantly concerned, but hope it works well" category. I think every customer should be in the "hope it works well category."
"I don't like this, so I won't even try it, and I want to see it fail out of spite" is just pointless.
I don't particularly want it to fail, but I don't need to try it to know its a nonstarter for me. The problems I have with it are entirely beyond the Wolves to do anything about and as such are not going to be anything I need to try another online application for me to know its problematic.
I am bothered that they seem to intend to use the same data files which means the same scripting language. They have said they intend to improve the UI scripting but my issues with customizing HL were never with the UI and always with the scripting and the way the program handles data. The reason there are so many questions is to a great degree because HL does things in a weird way rather than in a way that makes sense to people used to using other programs with scripting and modding capabilities.
They should be using the opportunity to fix and improve this part of HL so that users and content producers can more easily use the product.
The inability to use the product offline will be a big deal. GenCon still has no WiFi. A lot of people will walk into GenCon next summer with HLO on their devices and suddenly not have access to their characters and havoc will reign.
They should be using the opportunity to fix and improve this part of HL so that users and content producers can more easily use the product.
The inability to use the product offline will be a big deal. GenCon still has no WiFi. A lot of people will walk into GenCon next summer with HLO on their devices and suddenly not have access to their characters and havoc will reign.
ShadowChemosh
Well-known member
Normally you have pretty smart ideas but this is just crazy talk.
So you want the several millions lines of scripts that are running under HL to be re-written? All the community packs all the files on home PCs and groups and all the 3PP addons and files. Not including all the lines of code that are written right now running all the games HL supports (d20, Pathfinder, 5e, MM, Shadowrun...) Its taken 10+ years for HL to have that code created by thousands of scripters. But you want that changed?
Sorry that is a plan that will sink LW. The scripting language works VERY well at what it does. If you actually spend time learning the language it has very good reasons for working the way it does. Its the VERY reason we all love HL is because of the very powerful language that Rob developed. Everyone here that likes HL needs to understand its because of the scripting language that you enjoy it. Its what drives 95% of what you see and get out of HL. You want to print a character sheet, or prepare a spell, or make something in the editor? Guess what you just touched something that was created with the HL scripting language.
They are correctly going to reuse all those millions lines of code already created as I guarantee that Starfinder started as a fork of Pathfinder. Then they made specific modifications for the UI and to improve some "legacy" ideas and features. But sense it started as a Fork of Pathfinder (as really Starfinder is only a little different from Pathfinder) and uses the HL scripting language means many will be able to jump right in and start coding Starfinder scripts. That is a positive and smart thing for LW to do.
Last point is the guys that are doing work for 3PP are paid on a very tight time schedule. Meaning you change the scripting language , all the time they have to re-learn, is time they will NOT make money. That is a bad thing as some are pretty dependent on the money they make from paid HL work.
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One of my favorite movie quotes of all time, because it's so true: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K1Lo-d8AWL0#t=1m52s