Giving a Race a free skill of choice.

[Paragon]

I think this should be doable, looking at some of Zarlor's code for Edges, and at the Racial Trait that gives a D6 for a specific skill, but I'm not sure how to put the pieces together, especially since I don't understand the coding on menus:

I need to put together a Racial Trait that gives a member of the race one skill at a D6 free--but its not a specific skill, its one chosen individually for each member of the race. How do I go about this?

 

[CapedCrusader]

If each member gets to choose their own Skill, just give them 2 extra Skill build points when that is taken. You can't add a new Skill with a choice from a menu at that level.

 

[Paragon]

The problem is that as far as I know that'll let them buy two D4 skills, which the racial trait doesn't do. Its specifically a single D6 skill.

 

[Paragon]

Let me explain the kind of thing I'm thinking about doing, and maybe someone can tell me why it won't work, or how to make it work.

In the code thread, Zarlor has the following two entries:

"To grant a specific skill at d6 (we use Healing in this example):

Bootstrap: skHealing
Eval Script: Pre-Traits/5000

Code:

~This will offset the cost:
perform #resspent[resSkill,-,1,"Chaplain"]

~This will increase the Skill
foreach pick in hero where "thingid.skHealing"
eachpick.field[trtBonus].value += 1
nexteach

Note here that we had to use a Bootstrap to add the Healing Skill, then we offset the cost of it to make it free to have it, and finally we added "1" to the die type, since the Bootstrap gave us the skill at d4. if we added "2" we could start with a d8 in the skill, and so on."

Later on, he also has the following:

"To create a drop-down "pick list", let's say to apply a +1 roll bonus to one of three skills (the Scholar Edge is another example worth looking at):

Menu #1 Source: All Picks on Hero (this will make sure you don't get an error for trying to modify a skill that doesn't exist on the character)
Menu #1 Tag Expression: thingid.skBoating | thingid.skDriving | thingid.skPiloting
Eval Scripts: Pre-Traits/5000 - Before: Calc trtFinal

Code:

~apply the +1 modifier to selected skill
if (field[usrChosen1].ischosen <> 0) then
perform field[usrChosen1].chosen.field[trtRoll].modify[+,1,"Ordo Novus Templum"]
endif

-----"

I'm gathering these two concepts can't be combined in one thing for some reason? Would it make any difference if the racial ability, instead of directly doing this, gave you an Edge that did so?

 

[zarlor]

The problem is the bootstrapping part. You can only bootstrap a specific thing in the editor, there's no way to bootstrap an as-yet-unknown skill. It goes back to the only way to bootstrap something in code is to already have it bootstrapped (which in this case would mean bootstrapping EVERY skill to the character), using a tag to hide all of those skill and then, once the pick is made, unhiding just that one skill to reveal the already existing bootstrap. But then what about all the other skills that actually exist on the character but are now hidden? How can you take them normally if the character already has them but they are just hidden? So presumably you'd also have to code every other aspect of the system so that instead of bootstrapping skills normally they are unhidden instead.

I really, really, really wish the underlying Hero Lab configuration were changed to allow direct bootstrapping of things like this in code, and I've been asking for it for years because it just makes so much more sense to me (and most other folks wanting to mess with Hero Lab for this kind of stuff if this forum and posts like this are any indication) but for whatever reason I've never gotten any traction with the idea. It's either just not possible with the code base they are using or it's more work than Lone Wolf would find useful for the majority of cases, I guess.

 

[Paragon]

Ah. Well, hmm. I may just have to take CC's suggestion then, though that's not really what the racial ability does, unless I can come up with some other way to fake it.

I'm guessing the various "add a die size" things don't work with a skill you as yet don't have, either?

 

[Paragon]

Hey, what about this? Is it possible to use a racial ability to allow a player to get an extra Edge? Then limit that to a specific group of Edges? At that point I could have one Edge for each skill, and use the normal "grant a skill at D6" function. It'd be kind of time intensive, but wouldn't be having you pick the skill until during the normal parts of character generation. I don't know any way to do the "only get from this category of Edges" thing, though, so it might not be possible.

 

[zarlor]

That's... a lot of work for not a lot of payoff. Now you might bootstrap an Edge that gives the 2 skill points and add a domain requirement on that Edge where the player can annotate what skill it was they picked. Then you at least have some reminder on the sheet of where those skill points went. I don't think that's too much to ask of a player and when all is said and done you're talking about only a single race and how often does a player make a character that has nothing but d4 in all their skills? I've seen some builds that come close but I can't think of any in the Savage Worlds games we've been playing over the years where at least one of them wasn't a d6.

In my experience, there are just times when making a data file where it's just more appropriate to make the decision to say "You know, I'm just not going to try to code something to do that because the players/GMs can really do that very easily without my coding it in." I'd say that I think this is one of those times.

 

[Paragon]

You're probably right; its just my OCD getting away from me. It'd be a different story if the D6 was limited in what skills it could be put in, but its not.

 

[Paragon]

One more question, which I could find out just by trying it, but if there's anything special I need to do I figure I might as well know up front:

The same racial feature gives the race a number of free languages equal to their Smart die size, the same way the Setting Rule does. I know how to do the latter because I've got it coded into my XCOM file, but does it work properly for a character if you code it into them with a racial quality, too, or do I need to do that some other way?

 

[CapedCrusader]

This is not a new issue. It has to do with the way the program works. You can't add a pick from within a bootstrap. It's the same reason we weren't able to implement adding a new Skill with a Super Power. The code prevents it (and it's a huge waste of points, too... not cost effective).

And, yes, the Language addition should work fine no matter where the tag comes from.

 

[Paragon]

[Deleted because I'm an idiot. Moving along...]

 

[SeeleyOne]

For what it is worth, an option for choices at character creation just came to mind. It is possible to make Rewards that can only be added once and that can be precluded by other Rewards that have been taken.

So, if you want a race to pick one of a list of defined skills or edges you could have them as Rewards. You can then give them a 0 cost.

The benefits are:
1) Easy to add to a character
2) Done at character creation
3) Easy to mess with required bootstraps and whatever.

The disadvantages are:
1) It is selected in a slightly odd place, but this is somewhat mitigated in that most characters will pick something from that list anyway.
2) A player might forget to pick one.

 

[SeeleyOne]

Oh, you can add in a validation thing that will come up if you did not pick one. I might be able help you come up with one should you use it. I would recommend looking at the validation Simple that is used for attributes to give ideas.

 

[Paragon]

In the end, its probably easier to just add the two skill points than to add an extra reward that people will have to have explained to them.