d20 Update Fails to Update Duplicate d20 System

[Kendall-DM]

In the past, my duplicated game system for d20 was able to be updated when the newer versions came out. Today I tried to update the duplicated d20 system and it did not update. Even though I did not update the original d20 system, it stated it was updated.

I believe the update is only applied to the original d20 system folder, regardless of which system, original or duplicate, is the chosen system for the update.

 

[ShadowChemosh]

I have 5 d20 games, 9 Pathfinder games and 3 different 5e D&D games in HL. All update without issues as they should.

Can you list the "exact" steps your doing?

Here is how I update my 9 Pathfinder games:
1) Download and install to my main game (ie the normal default location).
2) After the update I go to the folder: C:\ProgramData\Hero Lab\download
3) I double click on the Pathfinder.hl file to start the installer again.
4) Click the "Change" button next to the "folder for game system". I then type in one of the additional folder names (ie Pathfinder_Pack).
5) Press "OK" and then "Start Import".
6) Repeat steps 3 to 5 for each additional folder/game.

 

[Kendall-DM]

Duh! So long away from the software and I forget that I have to change the folder. I knew that, but my memory... ooph. Thanks ShadowChemosh, I'm good to go now. *feeling stupid*

 

[Kendall-DM]

Got another issue though. Not seeing any of the Domain spell choices when selecting Domain spells. I do see the ones I've created for my own domains, but I don't see any of the ones from the standard d20 domains, so I can't select any of those spells.

I went and looked at all the spells that were created for this new feature, and none of the spells appear to choose the Spell Class for a Domain. For example, Acid Fog was a spell I input for the Water domain, at spell level 7, but for some reason the spAcidFog7 spell does not have any Spell Class selected. Did something change?

UPDATE: Nevermind, I found the issue. If there is a Replace Thing Id on a Domain, it isn't allowing for selection of spells from that originating domain. They have to be added to the new replacement, since those don't appear to be moving down (though the pre-existing spells don't seem to be affected on the replaced Domain).

 

[ShadowChemosh]

Got another issue though. Not seeing any of the Domain spell choices when selecting Domain spells.

I just created a level 1 cleric and added the Air domain. I set Wis to 13 and I added the domain spell "Obscuring Mist". I can't duplicate your issue.

I do see the ones I've created for my own domains, but I don't see any of the ones from the standard d20 domains, so I can't select any of those spells.

Need more info as I can't duplicate this.

I went and looked at all the spells that were created for this new feature, and none of the spells appear to choose the Spell Class for a Domain. For example, Acid Fog was a spell I input for the Water domain, at spell level 7, but for some reason the spAcidFog7 spell does not have any Spell Class selected. Did something change?

Yes this has all been redesigned. The "Domain" controls which spells are domain spells not the spell. HL is still backwards compatible but all the core domains have been updated to support this new logic. By having the domain support the spell, instead of spell supporting domain, it allows "new" and custom domains to be entered into d20 much easier.

In addition its possible to support via scripts now a Variant Domain idea where a domain provides a different spell at level 1, 4 and 6. Its allot more flexible.

From the FAQ:
How domain spells are linked to domains has changed but the old way will continue to work. The old way was to link a spell to a domain which made it hard to add new custom domains because it required the spell to be changed. Now to make things easier you define which spell is associated to a domain on the "Class->Cleric Domain" tab instead using the new button called "Domain Spells".

 

[Sendric]

Regarding the domain spells, the big change is that we no longer assign spells to a spell class associated with domains. Instead, we select the appropriate spells in the domain itself. This assigns a tag which then allows the selection of those spells.

Ninja'd

 

[Kendall-DM]

I updated my post (UPDATE) that indicates the real issue. It only occurs on replaced domains.

 

[Kendall-DM]

One other thing I noticed last night while running my game besides the replaced Domains missing spells.

The new spell features (adding the Area of Effect, Effect, Target) does not seem to appear on the spells that have already been selected by a hero. That is, it still shows the popup with the spell without these added to the spell stats. I was only able to get them to load the new statistics into the description by reloading the spells in the spell list. So preexisting heroes with spells in portfolios would have to have all their spells re-assigned to display the new descriptions in the spell popup.

 

[ShadowChemosh]

UPDATE: Nevermind, I found the issue. If there is a Replace Thing Id on a Domain, it isn't allowing for selection of spells from that originating domain. They have to be added to the new replacement, since those don't appear to be moving down (though the pre-existing spells don't seem to be affected on the replaced Domain).

To be clear the old way still works was meant in reference to 100% custom made domains and spells. You can still mark a spell to be associated with a domain if you wish.

But the CORE domains have been designed to reference the spells and the spells reference to the domains was removed.

Honestly I often forget about Replace Thing ID as I stopped using it because it just causes issue after issue. Much better to hide the LW version of things and make new. Or use scripts to modify the Pick directly.

If you have Replaced all the Core domains you will have to update them to reference the Spells. Or you will need to Replace Thing ID on all the Core Domain spells to reference the Domains again.

 

[ShadowChemosh]

The new spell features (adding the Area of Effect, Effect, Target) does not seem to appear on the spells that have already been selected by a hero. That is, it still shows the popup with the spell without these added to the spell stats. I was only able to get them to load the new statistics into the description by reloading the spells in the spell list. So preexisting heroes with spells in portfolios would have to have all their spells re-assigned to display the new descriptions in the spell popup.

Yep this is working exactly as designed. The old spells are marked with Helper.Obsolete and while they can NOT be added to characters anymore they will continue to appear for old characters.

As you build new characters you will get the new spells. Otherwise correct you need to remove the "old" obsolete spell and add it again to the character. In doing so the "new" fully implemented spells will be added to the character.

 

[Kendall-DM]

Ugh, that's gonna be a lot of work. I've got tons of portfolios with spells that will have to be regenerated, ouch. Plus the all the domains, since I replaced them all. My spells are a bit hairy right now, with all the special scripts I have in place to manage things, so this may take a while.

I've had no difficulties at all with the Replace Thing Id, I've used it extensively without issue. I do it because I don't feel I need to repeat myself (the principal of DRY in software development, which stands for don't repeat yourself). I usually only have to change one simple thing, such as a description or something like that, and I don't want to have to redo everything by remaking it.

Thanks for the info!

 

[ShadowChemosh]

I've had no difficulties at all with the Replace Thing Id

Because LW has not made changes to d20 in a long time. I am use to working in Pathfinder that is "CONSTANTLY" changed per release. You quickly get to a different way of thinking because each time LW fixed/enhanced a Replace Thing ID I was stuck fixing all my replace things.

I am sorry as I feel your pain but its exactly why I moved away from using Replace Thing ID. Basically you end up with "Deprecated" logic/Things because of the Replace Thing ID.

As for the spells you don't have to update the .por files as the old spells still work. Its only if you want the "new" full text description will you have to update. Unfortunately no other work around exists.

I try as much as I can to seamlessly make changes but its not 100% always possible. To move forward sometimes I have no choice but to dump the old logic. I am sure this will happen again when I do more classes fixes and monster fixes.

Sorry

 

[Kendall-DM]

Sorry

Don't be, it's all for a better product in the long run. A short term inconvenience here and there to improve the product over long term letting it fester is okidoki in my books. I was just hoping I didn't have to do all that work, but since I do, I'll just do it and be done with it.

Regardless of the Replace Thing Id, if I wasn't using it for the Domains, I'd still have to do the same amount of work. Because I like having all the spell text available at my beck and call.

In that regards, I still haven't sorted out the spell-like abilities that you changed in the last release. I've been wanting to leverage that, but life got in the way. Now I can get back to it and get my spell-like abilities to work more fluidly rather than the way I was handling them before.

Thanks for all the hard work dude!

 

[Sendric]

In that regards, I still haven't sorted out the spell-like abilities that you changed in the last release. I've been wanting to leverage that, but life got in the way. Now I can get back to it and get my spell-like abilities to work more fluidly rather than the way I was handling them before.

If it helps at all, I added a file to the community set specifically for spell-like abilities. I've been adding spells as I need them. I need to go back and update it a bit now that all of the core spells are available, but if you are needing to bootstrap a spell-like ability, there's at least a chance it's available there already.

 

[billy.hewlett]

I'm not sure this is the right place to post, but I'm stuck and I need help.

I have been using http://shadowsoftware.net/herolab/d20/Secondary Update URL Setup.pdf with Hero Lab for a very long time with no problems.

I recently logged in for the first time in a long time and I can no longer access the d20 content. For example when I load my character it no longer recognizes all of the Crusader levels.

The problems are:
1) When I try to load the module I get a warning of conflicts in the Spell Compendium. It says it will attempt to load them in recovery mode.
2) When I try to load my character I get a long list of all the sources that don't load
3) When I try to follow the steps listed in http://shadowsoftware.net/herolab/d20/Secondary Update URL Setup.pdf, when I get to step 8 I can't see "an updated named “Lawful_g d20(vX.XX)”... it doesn't appear in the list.

I think I must have uploaded something that I shouldn't have, but I've tried to get back to where I was by several different methods (for example manually loading from Lawful_G_d20(v1.21).hl on disk), and the same problems persist. How can I proceed?

Thank you very much for your help.