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Bug Reports - Version 2.8

Not true.
Runner's Companion page 110 said:
Metagenetic Qualities Metagenetic qualities are special Positive and Negative
qualities that can only be taken by characters with the appropriate genetic background. Only characters that have bought a metavariant metatype (pp. 70–72) or the changeling quality (p. 73) may choose qualities from this section.
Click to expand...
 
I think that's contradicted by pg 73: "The first step when creating a changeling character is to choose a normal metatype (human elf, dwarf, ork, or troll), metavariant..."

I think the part on pg 110 is talking about the fact that metavariants get free metagenetic qualities from their race - it's not allowing them to purchase more.
 
jbearwillis said:
Yes that is what I'm saying - Am I right or wrong on this - it is confusing me LOL - and if so is there a work around. I was Just asking because my Shadowmaster allows this.
Click to expand...

You're correct.

I originally misunderstood what was wrong, originally I thought you were saying that you took changeling and then wondered why the metagenetic qualities weren't counting against your 35 total quality points, once you posted that you were doing this to a Formori, it made more sense.
 
Ok LOL now I don't feel so stupid, lol - is there a work around, for this, Mathias and I would just like to thank you and CryptoKnight for the quick response from you too. This forum is the best.
 
That's not what the rules say. The original quote was talking about actual changeling characters... Metavariants are Metagenetic by default.
 
On the personal tab, in the "Permanent Adjustments" table, there's a "Negative Quality Build Point Limit" adjustment that you can use to allow more or less negative qualities.
 
I suppose you could read it either way. The best bet would be to get a clarification from the authors.

There's other problems with Metagenetic Qualities. Page 110 lists several normal qualities that are also metagenetic. We talked about this in the developers forum a few months back, and I forget what you had said, but this is important if somebody wants to use the negative qualities to offset something they changlinged for.
Other Metagenetic Qualities
In addition to the metagenetic qualities introduced below,
the following qualities available in Shadowrun, Fourth Edition
qualify as Metagenetic qualities (see Qualities, p. 77, SR4; New
Awakened Qualities, pp. 24–28, Street Magic; and Augmented
Qualities, pp. 20–22, Augmentation).
Other Positive Qualities: Astral Sight, Biocompatibility,
Double Jointed, High Pain Tolerance, Magic Resistance, Natural
Hardening, Natural Immunity, Quick Healer, Resistance to
Pathogens/Toxins, Spell/Spirit Knack, Toughness
Other Negative Qualities: Allergy, Asthma, Albinism,
Biosystem Overstress, Disease Carrier, Gene Freak, Low Pain
Tolerance, Nano Intolerance, Reduced (Sense), Sensitive System,
Uncontrolled Metastasis, Weak Immune System
Click to expand...
 
Mathias on that same page, in the paragraph below, it says this

(After a metatype is chosen, transforming the character into
a changeling is as simple as choosing one of the 3 levels of the
Changeling Positive quality (next column).)

it says Metatype , but does not say metavariant. what I read is the only ones that can take them are metatypes with the changeling quality, Metavariants and a Non-Metahuman sapient if a gamemaster allows it. Correct me if I'm wrong in the way it's stated.
 
It's a proofing issue, CGL are getting better but they still contradict themselves occaisionally.

The way I read these is Metavariants are metagenic simply because of their free qualities. The vast majority of times you see 'metatype' in the rules you should include metavariants too - it's the same with Humans (long ago some people didn't see human as a metatype).

Changling allows any other qualities besides the free ones. Least that's how I read it.

And yeah, HL doesn't allow normal qualities to be taken as metagenic ones.
 
You could read it that way... except of course the part of the book where it said that if you're a metavariant you can choose powers. Which is why I suggested getting clarification from Catalyst.
 
Well I just did what Mathias told me to do, it was a simple work around that worked.. So at this point I'm very happy. Thanks all - hope we can get an answer from Catalyst Game Labs soon - LOL
 
Fwiw, the only other character builders.... Chummer and the Excel spreadsheet from dumpshock both take different tacts... Chummer lets you add them, the excel spreadsheet does not. *sigh* so much for consensus.
 
if it helps, changelings can go over the 35 BP limit on negative and positive qualities. eg, SURGE 3 costs 15 points of the positive quality limit, none on the negative quality limit and gives the player 15 "free" (they get 30 and pay for 15) points of positive and 15 "free" negative points to spend. while it is true that the points kind of balance each other out, it dose mean that a changeling could spend 50 BP on positive and negative quality's.

also i do not see a contradiction in the rules, after all Formori are still limited to 35 BP of quality's. Formori Changling anyone?
 
Some errors found with the new Runners Companion release in Shadowrun: the positive qualities College Education and Linguist do not add any rating bonus for skills of rank 1. Also, the rating bonus gained on Languages from the Linguist quality should be +2, not +1.
 
Last edited:
Ozymandias said:
Some errors found with the new Runners Companion release in Shadowrun: the positive qualities College Education and Linguist do not add any rating bonus for skills of rank 1. Also, the rating bonus gained on Languages from the Linguist quality should be +2, not +1.
Click to expand...

SR4A, pg 68 (Skill Ratings): "The maximum modified rating allowed is 1.5 times the natural rating..."

So, with a skill rating of 1, you can't take advantage of the bonus rating you're getting from those qualities. You'll need a skill rating of at least 4 to get the full advantage from Linguist.
 
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