new update w/ skaven

[hakoMike]

I've linked a version of the datafile updated to handle a couple of the issues mentioned. *Not* a new release from Robert.

whfb.ab

 

[mageracer]

The Plague Furnace doesn't have a 4+ ward, only the Bell does.

And you should leave the one use on the storm banner, no tournament or reasonable person would ever let you play it without that for 50 points. It wouldn't end on a 4+ just so you could immediately restart it at any time.

 

[hondor]

couple of things i noticed
Storm vermin can not be upgraded when Queek is taken (previously mentioned)
Warp scroll has it's cost at 50 points, it should be only 35

you can take multiple of items from the scrap pile on one character
EG made a chieftain with 10 rat hound bodyguards

also crack's call's wording is incorect
you have
War machines and Chariots are destroyed on a 5+
it should read. War machines and Chariots must roll a 5+ to not be destroyed.

 

[Paul1Beck]

Just thought I'd mention that the Giant Rats with a master moulder will automatically purchase an additional pack master at 10 rats, whereas purchasing additional packmasters are completely optional.

 

[hondor]

pack masters are not being priced for rat ogre packs. (they cost 0 instead of 8)
Master Bread Rat ogres are taking a spot of a pack master

Eg) bought a unit of 4 rat ogres with 2 packmasters. came in at the cost of only the 4 rat ogres
I added the Master bred rat ogre, (increased price by amount as it should) but it reduced my pack masters to 1, and only changed the cost of the unit to 3 regular rat ogres with 1 master bred.

Grey seers are being given a 4+ armor save and a 4+ ward when on a screaming bell. should only have 6+ armor and a 4+ ward

Having general leadership issues with Assasins. If you take Death Master Snikch Armybuilder want's to make him general as he has ld 8. Assasins can not be generals.

 

[hondor]

Just thought I'd mention that the Giant Rats with a master moulder will automatically purchase an additional pack master at 10 rats, whereas purchasing additional packmasters are completely optional.

doing same thing when you take squeel, and as well with rat ogres.

 

[VonStrom]

Censer Bearers are capped at 9? Should not be capped unless I misread the army book.

 

[mageracer]

Here's an update. Not an official release, but changes I managed to figure out. (FYI The unit strength of the Bell/Furnace is a tumultuous subject right now on many forums. It is not well defined. I have set it here to 6 because that is the number of wounds that it has, and it most certainly not 4. I have heard numbers as high as 15 for the models it displaces, but there is no clarity. It will need to be updated as soon as it is addressed in a GW FAQ.)

http://rapidshare.com/files/324035577/whfb.ab

Skaven Bug Fixes:
- Removed ward save from the Plague Furnace.
- Removed 4+ armor save from the Screaming Bell. Changed to 6+.
- Removed ability for Deathmaster Snikch to be the Army's General.
- Added cost to Packmasters for Rat Ogres.
- Added Plague Banner to Plague Monks.
- Added Magic Armor ability to all Characters. (work around, be legal)
- Fixed Clanrats default armor save.
- Removed "Skirmisher" from Jezzails, added generic 4+ armor save.
- Fixed wording on Crack's Call.
- Changed Warp Scroll cost to 35 pts.
- Changed Unit Strength of Screaming Bell/Plague Furnace to 6.

Outstanding Issues:
- Adding a named character to a Clan Moulder unit (Giant Rats/Ogres) adds an additional unrequired packmaster.
- Stormvermin cannot be upgraded after taking Queek. (+1S, +1T for 1 Unit, +4pts/mdl.)
- Some characters can take Magic Armor who should not be able to.
- The Scavange Pile is not limited to a single item of each type. (eg. You can take multiple tail weapons, rat bodyguards)

 

[Mr_Rose]

For Queek's bodyguard, it might be easier to create a new unit called "queek's bodyguard" that has all the relevant upgrades built-in and can only be taken if Queek is in the list, like how the 40K guys do things like Belial's special Terminator Command Squad.

 

[Billysqueaky]

The Plague Furnace doesn't have a 4+ ward, only the Bell does.

And you should leave the one use on the storm banner, no tournament or reasonable person would ever let you play it without that for 50 points. It wouldn't end on a 4+ just so you could immediately restart it at any time.

Actually, with the storm banner and the one time use listing, it should be removed for now. nowhere in the army book does it state that it is a one us item, and i would love to see a tournament organizer tell me that I can't use it as stated in the book without a FAQ to back it up. The book specifically says that it can be started at the start of the opponent turn and ended on a 4+ at the start of your turn. It doesn't say that it is one time.

 

[Palamedes]

I think I have found an error;

If you purchase 4 rat ogres, and 2 pack masters then convert one rat ogre to a master bred rat ogre you are put back to 1 pack master..

Also if you have 3 rat ogres, and a master bred rat ogre, with Skweel there appears to be no way to add the 2nd pack master which as I understand it should be legal.. (2 pack masters for 4 rat ogres)


EDIT: looks like someone addressed this already further up.. sorry..

 

[jdarling]

Say, which version of AB is this file intended for? I'm using 3.1c, but when I try to import the file I've downloaded (wh6_v31.ab) I receive the message:

"The data files in this import file require a newer version of Army Builder. Please obtain the latest version of the product and try importing them again."

Is the latest update intended for v3.2?

 

[mageracer]

Actually, with the storm banner and the one time use listing, it should be removed for now. nowhere in the army book does it state that it is a one us item, and i would love to see a tournament organizer tell me that I can't use it as stated in the book without a FAQ to back it up. The book specifically says that it can be started at the start of the opponent turn and ended on a 4+ at the start of your turn. It doesn't say that it is one time.

Since the banner ends at the beginning of a turn, and you can start it at the beginning of any player turn, technically there is nothing stopping you from restarting it right immediately after it ends, so it is always up.

There are two options here.

Option 1:
The storm Banner can be used every turn
Option 2:
The Storm Banner can be used only once until its effect ends.

By strict RAW the banner ends on a roll of a 4+ and has no restriction on being reactivated. Lets explore what this means for the game, tournament scene and community as a whole if we accept this strict RAW view.

If the storm banner can be activated every turn the following armies becoming virtually unplayable:

Empire
Non forest spirit wood elves
Dwarves (to some extent)

The following units become useless:
terradons
gyrocopter
screamers
giant eagle
warhawk riders
carrion
fell bats

The following units become far less effective:
peg knights
furies
etc....

No single item should make whole armies unplayable nor make so many units useless or next to useless. Some argument can be made for the ring of hotek doing the same thing however the ring doesn't outright prevent you from casting merely makes it very difficult. This alone should make us at least consider RAI over RAW.

Next we can look at cost, for 50pts the banner is hideously undercosted for what it can do. This coupled with its ability to be put on a unit thus negating the need for even a BSB to carry such an overpowered banner strikes another blow for RAW.

We all know it should be played this way because the alternative is to heinous to consider.

 

[Batu]

Here's an update. Not an official release, but changes I managed to figure out. (FYI The unit strength of the Bell/Furnace is a tumultuous subject right now on many forums. It is not well defined. I have set it here to 6 because that is the number of wounds that it has, and it most certainly not 4. I have heard numbers as high as 15 for the models it displaces, but there is no clarity. It will need to be updated as soon as it is addressed in a GW FAQ.)

http://rapidshare.com/files/324035577/whfb.ab

Skaven Bug Fixes:
- Removed ward save from the Plague Furnace.
- Removed 4+ armor save from the Screaming Bell. Changed to 6+.
- Removed ability for Deathmaster Snikch to be the Army's General.
- Added cost to Packmasters for Rat Ogres.
- Added Plague Banner to Plague Monks.
- Added Magic Armor ability to all Characters. (work around, be legal)
- Fixed Clanrats default armor save.
- Removed "Skirmisher" from Jezzails, added generic 4+ armor save.
- Fixed wording on Crack's Call.
- Changed Warp Scroll cost to 35 pts.
- Changed Unit Strength of Screaming Bell/Plague Furnace to 6.

Outstanding Issues:
- Adding a named character to a Clan Moulder unit (Giant Rats/Ogres) adds an additional unrequired packmaster.
- Stormvermin cannot be upgraded after taking Queek. (+1S, +1T for 1 Unit, +4pts/mdl.)
- Some characters can take Magic Armor who should not be able to.
- The Scavange Pile is not limited to a single item of each type. (eg. You can take multiple tail weapons, rat bodyguards)

Cant imagine making the unit strength of the Furnace 15. It says it displaces about that many rats for rank bonus. Similar to the Slann displacement in TG. US would be wounds as normal.

Thanks for the update...hopefully Robert can get the official one out soon.