New Pathfinder beta - your opinion wanted!

[Colen]

Hi everyone,

We've got a new feature we'd like you to try out before it goes live in this month's Pathfinder update! To find out exactly what changed, check our news post, then return here:

http://www.wolflair.com/blog/2015/01/19/pathfinder-buy-update/

If you want to try this new beta out yourself, we'd love your input! You can download the beta from our web site:

http://www.wolflair.com/download/hp/pathfinder_beta.hl

Once you've downloaded the file, double-click it to import the new data files into Hero Lab.

Please note: There's currently a bug with how this new beta interacts with the "custom weapon / armor / potion / etc" form, so you may see some unusual behavior on that form. We're working on a beta version of Hero Lab that will solve this, and hope to have it ready soon.

Thanks, everyone! If you try out the beta, please let us know what you think - is the new purchase mechanism better? Worse? And why? We've love to get your input!

 

[Exmortis]

Holy heck that's awesome guys!!! great little change but really appreciated.

Id download and try it but I have way too much custom work on the go to try a beta, but I am sure going to like the change when it goes live!

 

[ShadowChemosh]

This month, we confined one of our hard-working data file authors to the salt mines, accompanied only by dire threats not to return until these issues were fixed.

Man and I thought LW would be a nice and FUN place to work. I guess I was very wrong!

 

[Aaron]

Man and I thought LW would be a nice and FUN place to work. I guess I was very wrong!

Some would disparage it, doubtless.
Even I would admit to getting frustrated from time to time.
No one should believe it is terrible, though.
Do your best, and things'll work out all right.

Having the opportunity to help shape an influential program for a hobby I love is great!
Even call it a privelage, if you must.
Little did I realize where my life would take me when I graduated from college.
Probably here is better than most jobs I would have landed!

 

[ShadowChemosh]

Some would disparage it, doubtless.
Even I would admit to getting frustrated from time to time.
No one should believe it is terrible, though.
Do your best, and things'll work out all right.

Having the opportunity to help shape an influential program for a hobby I love is great!
Even call it a privilege, if you must.
Little did I realize where my life would take me when I graduated from college.
Probably here is better than most jobs I would have landed!

Very nice! This is a haiku poem right? LOL no way could I make one of these.

I have to say based on the blog post if they catch you having enough time making a haiku poem "really" bad things could happen. Rob may just take you outside with a bag of pennies.

 

[ShadowChemosh]

Holy heck that's awesome guys!!! great little change but really appreciated.

Id download and try it but I have way too much custom work on the go to try a beta, but I am sure going to like the change when it goes live!

On the serious side of things. As this is a Pathfinder data package it can be loaded into a folder named Pathfinder_Beta. Then you can try it out without messing with your normal game.

See THIS post where I show such a thing off.

 

[Togainu]

Greetings Colen,

I have been shortly testing the beta currently. When I was trying to craft a magical weapon (to be precise in case it matters a +1 Scimitar).

1. checking custom cost? there were no pop up or fields to alter the price.
2. Crafted doesn't get reflected in the value or shown as what the price is you will have to pay
3. Once you selected crafted before and create a new custom item. it will show the value for crafting (even when unchecking crafting. From this point onwards it always seems to show crafting price)
4. When editing a custom weapon. the paid price is missing a , (Value: 1,105 GP, Paid 1105 GP)
5. The , is also missing while trying to sell the item
6. While selling the custom item it shows the value as the full value instead of the value you paid for it (I expect this is intentional but just in case.). Also the original paid price will be off if someone added later magical properties to it. (covered this slightly later on as an ability I would still love to see added)
7. Not really a major problem but more a question will the originally paid price keep it in full GP or will it be alter to GP, SP, CP? cause right now if a crafted piece ends up at 61517 GP 5 SP(Bastard's sting (crafted)). It will show up as 61517.5 GP originally paid

I expect some of these to be known considering the "Please note: There's currently a bug with how this new beta interacts with the "custom weapon / armor / potion / etc" form" part but just in case.

As I said only shortly tested it for now. So I might come across other things later. But besides some small kinks currently, I am happy with how this turned out. I see most of the features I saw requested implemented in it.

One thing I would like to see is the ability for upgrading magical items to calculate the new costs and just pay the value that is the difference or a field so we can fill it in there. So we can skip having to go to the journal to do the payment and that the paid price will be updated. (I can understand the issue with this tho and this most likely not going to make this update or the next couple)

Thank you all for the hard work you are doing on this

With kind regards,
Togainu

Ps. I will go deeper into how much I like it after it during a game/more testing to see how it feels over a longer term of time

 

[Aaron]

Hey, thanks for giving it a spin!

Greetings Colen,

I have been shortly testing the beta currently. When I was trying to craft a magical weapon (to be precise in case it matters a +1 Scimitar).

1. checking custom cost? there were no pop up or fields to alter the price.

That's one of the known issues Colen was mentioning. It's effectively an evaluation behind, so after checking the "Custom Price" box, change something else on the item like it's enhancement bonus to cause it to catch up and display the custom price boxes. Fixing it proper requires updates to the core engine, which we have a beta of. I don't think it will be a problem once we put out the full release.

2. Crafted doesn't get reflected in the value or shown as what the price is you will have to pay

Showing the cost you will pay before actually accepting for a custom built item is something I am working on.

3. Once you selected crafted before and create a new custom item. it will show the value for crafting (even when unchecking crafting. From this point onwards it always seems to show crafting price)

Yeah, that's a bug. I'm trying to work that out now.

4. When editing a custom weapon. the paid price is missing a , (Value: 1,105 GP, Paid 1105 GP)

That's working as intended. You haven't paid anything until you've confirmed and added the weapon. The record of what you paid is to serve as a reference when selling an item back or enhancing it further (not that enhancing is available yet).

5. The , is also missing while trying to sell the item

I don't understand. Where did you expect to see a comma but didn't?

6. While selling the custom item it shows the value as the full value instead of the value you paid for it (I expect this is intentional but just in case.). Also the original paid price will be off if someone added later magical properties to it. (covered this slightly later on as an ability I would still love to see added)

That is intentional, and enhancing existing magic items is a related, but separate project.

7. Not really a major problem but more a question will the originally paid price keep it in full GP or will it be alter to GP, SP, CP? cause right now if a crafted piece ends up at 61517 GP 5 SP(Bastard's sting (crafted)). It will show up as 61517.5 GP originally paid

In the final version the decimal will be converted to an equivalent amount of SP and CP.

 

[Togainu]

Hey Aaron,

Well for issue 5 when I actually have the item and are trying to sell it. you have the value that shows up as 123,035 GP and the originally Paid as 61517.5 GP instead of 61,517.5GP. which would end up with larger numbers being a little harder to read. But I think you already answered the reason at issue 4.

It is my pleasure for giving it a test run. I will be trying it out some more soon. Thank you all for the hard work you are putting into this and glad to hear most of those issues are already being worked on or fixed.

Greetings,
Togainu

 

[charlieluce]

I've tried out the beta, and for my Wizard it looks very nice. I liked that it picked up the existing Crafted Adjustment on his scrolls, though it would have been even nicer if there had been a way to add the Crafted modifier via Edit Item so that I didn't have a couple dozen of them cluttering up my Adjustment tab.

For my Gunslinger, though, I was disappointed to find that the Crafted check did not take into account the effect of the Gunsmithing Feat, which as you might imagine is a constant need for the character.

 

[ShadowChemosh]

so that I didn't have a couple dozen of them cluttering up my Adjustment tab.

So don't forget you can put these Adjustments on the "Personal" tab as they are "permanent" adjustments. So that is one way to clear up your Adjustments tab section.

 

[Aaron]

I've tried out the beta, and for my Wizard it looks very nice. I liked that it picked up the existing Crafted Adjustment on his scrolls, though it would have been even nicer if there had been a way to add the Crafted modifier via Edit Item so that I didn't have a couple dozen of them cluttering up my Adjustment tab.

For my Gunslinger, though, I was disappointed to find that the Crafted check did not take into account the effect of the Gunsmithing Feat, which as you might imagine is a constant need for the character.

Didn't realize gunsmithing gave non-standard crafting percentages. Ick. Thanks for bringing it to my attention.

 

[blzbob]

I haven't downloaded it yet but does it allow for someone to craft their sword at 1/3 then make it magical for 1/2? Taking both crafts into account for the same item?

 

[Aaron]

Yep, as per the rules, when crafting a magic weapon, the price is 1/3 for the weapon cost and the masterwork cost, and 1/2 for the enchantment cost.

 

[ShadowChemosh]

Yep, as per the rules, when crafting a magic weapon, the price is 1/3 for the weapon cost and the masterwork cost, and 1/2 for the enchantment cost.

So I am confused. How do I "craft" the magic part but not the base item cost? At least in my game no one has 6 months to "craft" a MW Longsword. So you buy the MW Longsword and then "craft" it to be +1. Or I found a +1 Longsword and then "crafted" it to be +2.

Just wondering if I missed something or it does not do this? If it don't its not a big deal I just want to understand so I can explain it to my players.

 

[Aaron]

Crafting's currently all or nothing if you want to have the purchase price automatically calculated for you. Buying a weapon pre-made and then upgrading it is another project for another day.

You can combine the Crafted checkbox with the Custom checkbox to pay a different amount if you are upgrading a mundane mwk longsword to a +1, but you'll have to figure out the exact amount for that yourself. That way it'll still count less than the full price against your wealth by level.

 

[ShadowChemosh]

Crafting's currently all or nothing if you want to have the purchase price automatically calculated for you. Buying a weapon pre-made and then upgrading it is another project for another day.

You can combine the Crafted checkbox with the Custom checkbox to pay a different amount if you are upgrading a mundane mwk longsword to a +1, but you'll have to figure out the exact amount for that yourself. That way it'll still count less than the full price against your wealth by level.

Cool! That makes sense. Thanks Aaron!

 

[Exmortis]

That way it'll still count less than the full price against your wealth by level.

That chart is but a guideline anyway not a "must hand them free gold to make the numbers" rule.

 

[Togainu]

Greetings team,

As promised I would get back to you after a few games on this beta. Besides the earlier points made in this thread by everyone, I haven't come across any new bugs or issues.

Further more I enjoy the ease of use and the functionality it adds a lot and will probably keep using this beta till the full release comes out. I thank you all greatly for the time and effort you all put into this.

with kind regards,
Togainu

 

[Portilis]

That chart is but a guideline anyway not a "must hand them free gold to make the numbers" rule.

It is a hard limit to what people can have in some games (some GMs follow PFS's example).

The change isn't going to make a massive difference in the games I'm involved with, but it'll be nice to have all the same.


It's been interesting reading the opinions on crafting in the general forums. The games I run & play in are on the opposite end to what seems most people's style - the concept of magic item "upgrading" doesn't sit well with us, so all magic items crafted have to be done so from scratch as part of the process of making the original item. Some of the games have had long time periods, others run more immediately, but realistically unless you're making adamantine weapons, the timescale isn't ridiculous - about 8 weeks for someone who is only just capable of doing it fairly reliably (i.e. 10 in the craft skill) to make it, reducing as the skill goes up.

It has the nice effect of making crafted gear feel like something special, rather than just being able to churn it out as desired.