Money, Money, Money

[Colen]

Hi everyone,

This month, we've been laying the groundwork for some changes to how money works in Pathfinder. In the next Pathfinder release, you'll see a few of those changes:

1. Starting cash is more robustly implemented and can now be changed on the Classes tab, after you pick a class for the character. Level 1 PCs can have Hero Lab roll their starting cash (using the correct value for their class), while NPCs and higher-level PCs have their starting cash automatically set to the appropriate values. (You can still set your own custom starting cash values if you want, and we're not changing any starting cash values on existing heroes.)
2. The Journal tab will now show a transaction log of the purchases and sales you've made, including the items that were bought and sold, and their cost.
3. You can now customize the names, values and weights of the coins used for purchasing, and define up to 4 additional coin types (if you wanted to rename "gold pieces" to "steel pieces", for example, or to define additional coin types entirely).

Before making further changes, we wanted to ask you, our users, what features and functions are missing from Hero Lab's buying / selling mechanics. When you're purchasing or selling gear, what do you want to do that Hero Lab doesn't support? What other features would be useful in your games?

Thanks for your help!

 

[Togainu]

Not sure if this will fall under this already or not (and instead under UI together with these changes). But being able to search for things that you can currently afford/a range between 2 price points you can set.

Thanks already for the hard work that went into this and is still going into this

 

[brock]

(2) is very helpful indeed for Pathfinder Society Play. Being able to easily output that on a separate piece of paper would be useful, or even just get the data out as XML so I can reformat it myself.

 

[brock]

Not sure if this will fall under this already or not (and instead under UI together with these changes). But being able to search for things that you can currently afford/a range between 2 price points you can set.

As an extension of the current search functionality, that would be fantastic. For example, search for 'ioun' between 0gp and 2,300gp.

 

[Genthar]

#2 definitely for PFS play.

Perhaps along with #2, an ability to note how an item was received. e.g. drop/loot or purchased, would be nice. Not sure it's essential though.

 

[Arazyr]

An "undo" feature for a transaction would be helpful, in case an item is bought or sold accidentally or by mistake.

Other than that, I second the transaction log, and search by price suggestions.

 

[Hberthou]

An "undo" feature for a transaction would be helpful, in case an item is bought or sold accidentally or by mistake.

Other than that, I second the transaction log, and search by price suggestions.

That would be kind of "need to have" with the transaction log.

I would like item with quantities to have an option to be removed when they have been used instead of having to sell it for 0.

 

[Silveras]

I have had players divide their money in specific ways and locations .. such as hiding an emergency stash of money sewn into the linings of a cloak, or stored in a bank (the Church of Abadar offers banking services in Pathfinder's world of Golarion).

Additionally, the current abstract money makes it hard to transfer funds between PCs the way items can be.

For these reasons, I (and others) added specific coin types as gear items (since incorporated into the Community Pack). I use these for all of my money handling at this time, converting to the abstract when I need to purchase goods for the character(s) in question, and back to coin gear items when done.

The separate coin gear items also lends itself well to having a pet or pack animal carry cash loot before it is divided.

 

[charlieluce]

I'd like Silverdisks to be added as a currency.

I'd like the ability to buy specified quantities of custom Ammunition instead of having to always buy 50 and then sell back what you don't want.

I second the option to remove consumables (items or charges) when used instead of just ticking off a counter (the option could then show how many are left, like Hit Points and Hero Points do) and the search by price.

It would be amazing to be able to export items to a file that could be imported into a character in another portfolio, but I don't think that's a practical request.

 

[Kendall-DM]

Hi everyone,

This month, we've been laying the groundwork for some changes to how money works in Pathfinder. In the next Pathfinder release, you'll see a few of those changes:

1. Starting cash is more robustly implemented and can now be changed on the Classes tab, after you pick a class for the character. Level 1 PCs can have Hero Lab roll their starting cash (using the correct value for their class), while NPCs and higher-level PCs have their starting cash automatically set to the appropriate values. (You can still set your own custom starting cash values if you want, and we're not changing any starting cash values on existing heroes.)
2. The Journal tab will now show a transaction log of the purchases and sales you've made, including the items that were bought and sold, and their cost.
3. You can now customize the names, values and weights of the coins used for purchasing, and define up to 4 additional coin types (if you wanted to rename "gold pieces" to "steel pieces", for example, or to define additional coin types entirely).

Before making further changes, we wanted to ask you, our users, what features and functions are missing from Hero Lab's buying / selling mechanics. When you're purchasing or selling gear, what do you want to do that Hero Lab doesn't support? What other features would be useful in your games?

Thanks for your help!

Colen, will this functionality become available for the d20 system as well? I've been wanting something like this for a while, and I've had to put a workaround in place currently, but it's a PITA. I would love this ability.

Does this mean you can apply this new coinage to the pricing of gear as well?

 

[ShadowChemosh]

Starting cash is more robustly implemented and can now be changed on the Classes tab, after you pick a class for the character. Level 1 PCs can have Hero Lab roll their starting cash (using the correct value for their class), while NPCs and higher-level PCs have their starting cash automatically set to the appropriate values. (You can still set your own custom starting cash values if you want, and we're not changing any starting cash values on existing heroes.)

What will HL do for classes without starting cash values entered in the .user files? Will it default back to the 150gp or zero?

 

[Aldaron]

I'd like Silverdisks to be added as a currency.

I'd like the ability to buy specified quantities of custom Ammunition instead of having to always buy 50 and then sell back what you don't want.

I second the option to remove consumables (items or charges) when used instead of just ticking off a counter (the option could then show how many are left, like Hit Points and Hero Points do) and the search by price.

It would be amazing to be able to export items to a file that could be imported into a character in another portfolio, but I don't think that's a practical request.

You can get around that at the moment by using ShadowChemosh's adjustments. With it, you can "buy" gold coins, silver coins, etc, and they become part of your gear. You can then create containers and locations to hide the coins - of course, it no longer reflects in your actual monetary "bank" amount.

But it's still pretty handy.

 

[Aldaron]

I have had players divide their money in specific ways and locations .. such as hiding an emergency stash of money sewn into the linings of a cloak, or stored in a bank (the Church of Abadar offers banking services in Pathfinder's world of Golarion).

Additionally, the current abstract money makes it hard to transfer funds between PCs the way items can be.

For these reasons, I (and others) added specific coin types as gear items (since incorporated into the Community Pack). I use these for all of my money handling at this time, converting to the abstract when I need to purchase goods for the character(s) in question, and back to coin gear items when done.

The separate coin gear items also lends itself well to having a pet or pack animal carry cash loot before it is divided.

Sorry...initially replied to the wrong post.


I'd like the ability to buy specified quantities of custom Ammunition instead of having to always buy 50 and then sell back what you don't want.

I second the option to remove consumables (items or charges) when used instead of just ticking off a counter (the option could then show how many are left, like Hit Points and Hero Points do) and the search by price.

It would be amazing to be able to export items to a file that could be imported into a character in another portfolio, but I don't think that's a practical request.[/QUOTE]

You can get around that at the moment by using ShadowChemosh's adjustments. With it, you can "buy" gold coins, silver coins, etc, and they become part of your gear. You can then create containers and locations to hide the coins - of course, it no longer reflects in your actual monetary "bank" amount.

But it's still pretty handy.

 

[Aaron]

Colen, will this functionality become available for the d20 system as well? I've been wanting something like this for a while, and I've had to put a workaround in place currently, but it's a PITA. I would love this ability.

Does this mean you can apply this new coinage to the pricing of gear as well?

The d20 system is under ShadowChemosh's purview, though I would be happy to provide any guidance he needed to set up a similar thing.

I've also been waiting for this sort of thing for a while, so I was glad to have the opportunity to call finally call "gp", "stl" in my own system.

The system relies on the user defining which coin is the "base coin", with a value of 1. Everything like price or total wealth is expressed in term of that coin, and purchases using custom coins are converted as necessary.

For example, you could rename the 3rd coin from gp to stl. By default this coin has a value of 1, and is the base coin. Say you then change the next lowest coin (coin 2) to be worth .5 of the base coin and rename it to "ip". Your purse has 4 ip and 3 stl.

If you buy something with a cost of .5, it will subtract 1 ip. If you bought something with a cost of 4, it will spend all your ip and 2 stl. And so forth.

Went through a lot of trouble making it so that the values are adjustable. Oh, one thing people will need to keep in mind is that if you adjust the values of coins for an existing character, that would affect their current wealth.

Hope that clarifies things.

 

[Aaron]

What will HL do for classes without starting cash values entered in the .user files? Will it default back to the 150gp or zero?

It will default to 0 for new characters, pre-existing ones should retain any starting cash they entered before. Those higher than 1st level (or PFS 1st level characters) will have a suggested flat value based on the wealth table. Starting cash is also frozen once you add cash or XP through a journal.

 

[TheIronGolem]

For example, you could rename the 3rd coin from gp to stl. By default this coin has a value of 1, and is the base coin. Say you then change the next lowest coin (coin 2) to be worth .5 of the base coin and rename it to "ip". Your purse has 4 ip and 3 stl.

If you buy something with a cost of .5, it will subtract 1 ip. If you bought something with a cost of 4, it will spend all your ip and 2 stl. And so forth.

This is so cool, and had to be such a pain to implement, that I'm going to feel obligated to make up new names for the currency in my next campaign just so I don't feel guilty for wasting your efforts.

 

[Krothos]

I'll be changing my to cows (pp), pigs (gp), goats (sp), and chickens (cp).

 

[Aaron]

I hear in Nevada they use to use chickens to pay for their health care.

 

[Silveras]

It would be amazing to be able to export items to a file that could be imported into a character in another portfolio, but I don't think that's a practical request.

When I talk about transferring money from character to character, that is something you can do NOW with gear.. if they're in the same portfolio. As GM, I keep current copies of the PCs in a single portfolio that I use while running the game. Present functionality allows you to "Give to character" for gear items, and transfer it to the other character. I'm not thinking about exporting gear and importing elsewhere.

However... if you don't mind moving things around... assuming you have two characters, each in a separate portfolio..

1. Open the character you want to give FROM.
2. Import the character you want to give things TO from its portfolio.
3. Move gear as desired.
4. Export the second character back to the original file (assuming it was the only one there), over-writing the file
5. Delete the second character copy from the working portfolio
6. Save changes

 

[charlieluce]

The issue is when the characters are on different machines (i.e., me and my players). I can work around it with a blank holding character, but it would be nice to be able to save the steps in the workaround.