Modifying Category Definitions

[RubbishNonsense]

I am new to Realm Works. I'm trying to modify some of the category definitions but even when I unprotected a category I can not delete any of the default snippets or delete unwanted categories. I find the same for tags. There are a lot of tags just not relevant for me and I'd like to de clutter things but cannot figure out how. Is this possible and if so how?

Thanks.

 

[kbs666]

You want to delete types of snippets? Or just snippets in a specific topic type?

What I've done is to create my own category that started with a default category as a base and then customized from there. For instance I built a deity category off the default entity category that includes stuff specific to deities like domains.

 

[Lexin]

I don't think it's a good idea to remove or amend the snipped types or categories which are supplied as standard. Just ignore the ones you don't want.

I think Wolflair may have created them for a reason and that reason may be to do with the content market. Who knows what tangles you will end up with if you delete something important.

 

[MNBlockHead]

The RealmWork's World Builder Guide, in the "Structure Management" section, clarifies what is safe to delete. See subsection 2.3.4 "Global Structure Protection" on page 35. The manual itself is available from the help tab of an open realm in RealmWorks.

The general rule is to create your own custom category or tag domain and hide the Global ones you don't want to use. Similarly, you can hide tags you don't want.

That said, you do have the ability to remove global protection and delete categories and tags that are added by default. Only do this if you are sure you will not import content from the content market or other game masters using RW. This has been discussed in other threads. One user, Parody, deleted ALL global categories (if I remember correctly) and created everything from scratch for his Paranoia campaign, but he knows exactly what he is getting into and doesn't plan to import anything into that realm.

If you have any uncertainty, HIDE, don't delete.

On the other hand, you are only affecting the one realm. Removing protection from and deleting global categories from one realm will have no effect on your other realms. You are not going to break RW at most, you'll create issues for importing third-party content into the specific realm whose categories and tags you've deleted.

 

[Parody]

I am new to Realm Works. I'm trying to modify some of the category definitions but even when I unprotected a category I can not delete any of the default snippets or delete unwanted categories. I find the same for tags. There are a lot of tags just not relevant for me and I'd like to de clutter things but cannot figure out how. Is this possible and if so how?

As you've found, there's a lot of things you can't do with the Globals. All you can do is hide things, not delete them.

Others have mentioned this already, but best practice for removing things from the Global Categories/Tag Domains is to either:

• Hide the things you don't want in the Global Category/Tag Domain and add the things you do.
• Duplicate one of the existing Categories/Tag Domains and modify the copy. Hide the original if you're not going to use it.
• Create your own Categories/Tag Domains from scratch.

One user, Parody, deleted ALL global categories (if I remember correctly) and created everything from scratch for his Paranoia campaign, but he knows exactly what he is getting into and doesn't plan to import anything into that realm.

I haven't deleted any of the globals. I don't use most of them, but I only hide them. (One Category has Protection removed, from before I decided to go completely with new/duplicated Categories; I'd revert it if that was an option.)

Most of my Paranoia Categories are modified duplicates of an existing Category.

 

[MNBlockHead]

I haven't deleted any of the globals. I don't use most of them, but I only hide them. (One Category has Protection removed, from before I decided to go completely with new/duplicated Categories; I'd revert it if that was an option.)

Most of my Paranoia Categories are modified duplicates of an existing Category.

Sorry for misrepresenting your workflow.

So that's the consensus. Hide don't delete.

 

[rob]

Sorry for being a little late to the party. It's actually NOT possible to delete any of pre-defined categories. The only option available is to hide them.

The reason for this is that published content from us will utilize those categories. If you import published content, the categories upon which the topics are based must still be around for us to reference. In addition, hiding them leaves them around for reference within the Manage Categories interface, allowing them to be unhidden if you change your mind or used as the basis for new custom categories.

When hidden, the only place a categories should appear is within the Manage Categories interface.

 

[Vargr]

I can see many good reasons for having a set of known and global categories.

I would just have imagined, that importing a package would also import the categories it would need. Then again - it would probably cause all sorts of grief, such as:
- would each package you import add to a growing list of identical and near-identical categories
- how should the system distinguish the categories from one another
- etc.

Now I wonder:
If I copy a category (say Entity) and then change everything to my heart's contend, will it be OK to save the new category with the same name as the original?

Apart from the problem with telling them apart, will it cause any system-wise problems?

The reason for doing this is that I want to make some home-brewed categories but I really like the name already taken by a pre-defined category.

I very much imagine I am going to hide the pre-defined category in every case (if for no other reason, then for the sake of my own sanity).

 

[Parody]

My thoughts on this are much the same as Vargr's. The Globals shouldn't be inviolate; they should just import themselves again like any other Realm's Categories if needed. But that's not what they chose. ::shrug::

As far as duplicating names, my guess is that each Category and Tag Domain are actually identified by realm-local unique IDs. (These could be GUIDs or use some other scheme.) That way shared items can be tied to their source realm by their ID and the realm's GUID. The name is only for display purposes for the silly humans. :)

In my Paranoia realm I ended up adding " (Paranoia)" to my Categories whose names would have been the same as the Globals and starting the Abbreviation with "pxp". Thus "Location" became "Location (Paranoia)" and "Loc" became "pxpLoc". (If it became relevant, there'd also be "p1e", "p2e", "p25", and "p6e" Abbreviations, but as I originally didn't plan on handling multiple versions of the system "pxp" became the generic one.)

 

[Vargr]

Well, the system just warns me that I will have two categories with the same name - the system doesn't prohibits it.

I just don't want to take the chance on my master realm before I get confirmation that I am not shooting myself in the foot - or face, as the case might be.

I am not too keen on the "Individual (Vargr's version)" solution :-/

 

[MNBlockHead]

Rob thanks for the clarification, but I have one followup question...what happens when you make your own version of a category and hide the default one and then latter import content that uses the original global category?

Luckily, most of the categories work for me right out of the box. There are some tag options I never use, but I only see them when selecting from tag list, which doesn't put me off. I just ignore them. I did, however create my own spell topic to better match DnD5e's spell format. So I hid "Spell/Power" and have my custom topic "Spell."

What will happen when I buy content that has its own customer spells? With the Spell/Power topic become unhidden?

I know you have a big announcement coming up that will answer a lot of the CM-related questions. Hopefully, it will address the issue of hidden global topics as well.

 

[rob]

I can see many good reasons for having a set of known and global categories.

I would just have imagined, that importing a package would also import the categories it would need. Then again - it would probably cause all sorts of grief, such as:
- would each package you import add to a growing list of identical and near-identical categories
- how should the system distinguish the categories from one another
- etc.

That's just for starters. The list of complications is actually quite lengthy and would make any sane person check themselves into an institution for awhile. Consider also what happens when one piece of published content builds on other piece of published content, and so on.

Now I wonder:
If I copy a category (say Entity) and then change everything to my heart's contend, will it be OK to save the new category with the same name as the original?

Apart from the problem with telling them apart, will it cause any system-wise problems?

The reason for doing this is that I want to make some home-brewed categories but I really like the name already taken by a pre-defined category.

I very much imagine I am going to hide the pre-defined category in every case (if for no other reason, then for the sake of my own sanity).

There would be no issues at all, aside from being able to tell the two categories apart. If you want to adapt pre-defined categories to suit your own purposes, you should simply clone the existing one, customize your new one, and hide the old one to avoid confusion.

 

[rob]

My thoughts on this are much the same as Vargr's. The Globals shouldn't be inviolate; they should just import themselves again like any other Realm's Categories if needed. But that's not what they chose. ::shrug::

There are arguments in both directions on this, neither of which yield a clear advantage over the other. By opting for the "hide" option instead of deleting, we made things more forgiving and readily recoverable for someone who gets started down one path and then wants to re-think the approach. For someone who is very deliberate and has spent the time to consider their design before setting up a custom category structure, the "hide" philosophy is probably sub-optimal. But for someone who thinks they know what they want and dives in, then reconsiders their strategy and wants to change/refine it, having the original categories around can be critically important. And hiding them avoids having to implement all the UI mechanisms for users to recover the stuff they deleted, so it was also more expedient this way. So it was a win-win from our perspective.

 

[rob]

Rob thanks for the clarification, but I have one followup question...what happens when you make your own version of a category and hide the default one and then latter import content that uses the original global category?

Luckily, most of the categories work for me right out of the box. There are some tag options I never use, but I only see them when selecting from tag list, which doesn't put me off. I just ignore them. I did, however create my own spell topic to better match DnD5e's spell format. So I hid "Spell/Power" and have my custom topic "Spell."

What will happen when I buy content that has its own customer spells? With the Spell/Power topic become unhidden?

I know you have a big announcement coming up that will answer a lot of the CM-related questions. Hopefully, it will address the issue of hidden global topics as well.

The only time you'll see the old category is when topics based on that category need to display their category. In the scenario you outlined, the category will reappear within the navigation pane if you have RW configured to show the individual category groupings. All the topics defined based on the hidden category will be shown within it. The category will also be shown next to topics within the automatic link detection process, since the category is an important distinguishing characteristic. But the category will not appear when it's optional, because it's still hidden. For example, when you go to create a new topic, the hidden category won't be shown. It similarly won't appear in the list of categories for the Quick Create mechanism. Etc.

 

[Exmortis]

The only time you'll see the old category is when topics based on that category need to display their category. In the scenario you outlined, the category will reappear within the navigation pane if you have RW configured to show the individual category groupings. All the topics defined based on the hidden category will be shown within it. The category will also be shown next to topics within the automatic link detection process, since the category is an important distinguishing characteristic. But the category will not appear when it's optional, because it's still hidden. For example, when you go to create a new topic, the hidden category won't be shown. It similarly won't appear in the list of categories for the Quick Create mechanism. Etc.

One way to combat this is change the name slightly so you know which is the original and which is your revamped category.

All my revamped categories begin with "My", for example the very first one I revamped was "Community" so now I have one called "My Community" and I leave the old one in play. Makes my list a little longer but I use the same icons and leave them in the same sub group if it is in one.

 

[Vargr]

There would be no issues at all, aside from being able to tell the two categories apart. If you want to adapt pre-defined categories to suit your own purposes, you should simply clone the existing one, customize your new one, and hide the old one to avoid confusion.

Thanks for the clarification!

Now I know what I will be doing this weekend

 

[MNBlockHead]

Thanks for the clarifications Rob! Looking forward to the upcoming announcements.

As for taking the hide approach to global categories, I think that makes sense. RW has so many options and is so configurable, that new users really don't know exactly how they will use it and do change their minds. Right now, RW is forgiving and, for the most part, makes it easy to change your mind and reorganize.

I'm sure this has saved you from having to address hundreds of wailing e-mails about how to get deleted default categories back.