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Enlarging a already large person

N

NeoEvaX

Well-known member
So I am having difficulty with an adjustment. One of my players has made a custom race, Centaur.

Breakdown:
Monstrous humanoid
Size: Large
Trait: Quadruped

This means she still uses medium sized weapons, but is large.

Now when you use the adjustment for the spell Enlarge Person (I know she is monstrous, but here me out.

It does a few things:
1. It makes her Huge
2. Increases the size of her weapon to large
3. Decreases her Dex by -2
4. -1 to AC (plus the -1 from DEX)
5. -1 to Hit

What it doesn't do, that I think it should.
1. Give +2 to STR
2. Provide Reach

Now to a normal medium PC it does do this. Also if I give a already large creature (I used an Achaierai for example because it is also a quadruped), it does provide those things to them.

Any reason why this would not work. This can be duplicated by doing this.
1. Creating a Custom Race - Monstrous
2. Size Large
3. Racial Trait: Quadruped
(Any other stuff to get rid of error).

Then adding the adjustment. HL bug or am I missing something?
 
I would register this as a bug, since the +2 size bonus from the spell is not stacking with the +2 size bonus granted by the custom race type.

There is some note on the Enlarge Person spell that says that size bonuses from magical sources do not stack, but the custom race is not a magical source.

The reach not increasing might be due to a similar scripting problem.
 
Farling said:
There is some note on the Enlarge Person spell that says that size bonuses from magical sources do not stack, but the custom race is not a magical source.
Click to expand...
HL does not track source. It knows it has a +2 "Size" Bonus and it won't stack. Which appears to only being applied by the Custom Monster size change script. If you actually use a Centaur the Centaur gets a +2 Str bonus increase.
 
Yes, my mistake in misreading the Enlarge Person spell description.

It actually says "Multiple magical effects that increase size do not stack" (which I misread as talking about size bonuses.)

The wording of the spell specifically says if the size was changed to Large, then you gain a reach of 10ft, but in this case the creature is already large. :-o
 
So would you consider it a bug, Shadow?

Why does the DEX go down then?

If I had to guess, the Custom Monster should be untyped bonus to strength because of large. Correct?

The spell does only speak as if you are starting as medium, but imagine there are ways for large creatures to have this spell. And it does work correctly for other large (quadruped) creatures in HL. The Custom Monster seems broken.

If it does seem like a bug I can actually submit it as a bug to HL. I just wanted to check with the forums to verify I am not crazy.
 
NeoEvaX said:
So would you consider it a bug, Shadow?
Click to expand...
Its hard to say because you have a unique situation. Add in the argument its not being used on a humanoid and you are into houserules. Sorry.... :(

NeoEvaX said:
Why does the DEX go down then?
Click to expand...
Penalties always stack regardless of type.

NeoEvaX said:
If I had to guess, the Custom Monster should be untyped bonus to strength because of large. Correct?
Click to expand...
Bestiary rules say it is "typed" as size when making a size change. Which is different than just saying your character starts as large. Its sort of gray area...

NeoEvaX said:
The spell does only speak as if you are starting as medium, but imagine there are ways for large creatures to have this spell. And it does work correctly for other large (quadruped) creatures in HL. The Custom Monster seems broken.
Click to expand...
Is it broken or following RAW rules from the bestiary? I am not really arguing for or against as its pretty nitch issue...

NeoEvaX said:
If it does seem like a bug I can actually submit it as a bug to HL. I just wanted to check with the forums to verify I am not crazy.
Click to expand...
I am not sure they will see it as a bug. May just need to use another misc adjustment to increase the Str by +2 if that is what you want.

But if you want an "official" answer a bug report will get you that. :)
 
yeah, going to submit a real bug report, and see how it comes back.

Worst cast I can add addtional adjustments to provide reach, and to add to strength whenever Enlarge Person is in affect.

I know that enlarge person does not really work with Monsterous Humanoids to begin with, but there are other items that increase size. And spells too.

Thank you for your time breaking it down though. The main sticking point for me is that it works for normal monsters that are large. Either way needs to go, I imagine.
 
NeoEvaX said:
If I had to guess, the Custom Monster should be untyped bonus to strength because of large. Correct?
Click to expand...

The bonus for a "Large" custom monster are mostly size bonuses/penalties (see http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/advancedRaceGuide/raceBuilder/racialQualities.html#size-quality).

Each modifier is listed as a size bonus, except the Combat maneuver modifier.

Unfortunately, penalties do stack :-( (see http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/coreRulebook/gettingStarted.html#stacking)

Therefore, the only issue is what happens with Reach?
 
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