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- The Lone Wolf Development Team
Gen Con 2017
- Thread starter BJ
- Start date
Maidhc O Casain
Well-known member
Wrong thread for this sort of question, which has been questioned and answered in other threads
Apologies - I must have missed the recent answers. If you could point me in the right direction I'd appreciate it.
In the news post linked in the first post of this thread they said the Content Market is "hopefully making its debut after Labor Day". Everything else comes after that.
Maidhc O Casain
Well-known member
Thanks, Parody - that's what I needed.
Dark Lord Galen
Well-known member
@ruhdar & Parody ....Sorry I missed u both. Maybe next year... 
@Parody did see some car wars love going on at Lucas Oil old games area.
Did manage to get my "youngsters" into a 2e D&D game (they ares still rubbing their head on THACO hehehe) and abit of chainmail jousting....
and for me.... a bit of Dawn Patrol with Mike Carr (the creator) moderating.. so that was very nostalgic.
@Parody did see some car wars love going on at Lucas Oil old games area.
Did manage to get my "youngsters" into a 2e D&D game (they ares still rubbing their head on THACO hehehe) and abit of chainmail jousting....
and for me.... a bit of Dawn Patrol with Mike Carr (the creator) moderating.. so that was very nostalgic.
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I only went to the Content Market seminar and I know they were recording that one.
You met BJ?!? I stopped by the booth a few times to touch bases with her and kept missing her. I did talk to Anna and Rob. Hopefully Anna has her full voice back and Rob got some food and sleep.
Always a joy to meet new people! Sorry I was so hard to find for many this year. Being a Guest of Honor wrecked my schedule. I'm always happy for new friends on Facebook though. Keep in mind, If we have less than 30 friends in common please send me a FB message confirming you are a real person or I may decline for personal safety
Dark Lord Galen
Well-known member
Well that's good to know. Perhaps we will have some partial ones at least? (@ BJ
)I sat in on the Realm Works 101 Streamlined on Friday and the Herolab on Saturday and didn't see any evidence that they were filming.. but I have known to fail my spot check... hehe:
I was scheduled to go to the content market one you mentioned, but opted to skip and spend time with Tim Kask, Mike Carr, and Luke Gygax, for me a no brainer trade.
One "interesting thing" I observed in the Friday RW seminar was at the beginning. Joe polled the audience (22 people) and asked:
1> How many were players? 1
2> How many were DMs(GMs) 21
3> How many used RW for Novel / Story Writing? 1
4> How many purchase pre-made modules for their gaming table? 2
5> How many create their own game / campaign worlds?18
6> How many use a campaign setting? 3
The most interesting one I found was #4, and IF it's a microcosm of the large community it flies in the face of RW business model for purchase content.
The big (and long endured) push for the Content market against this small sampling shows a possible contradiction. Based on that impromptu poll, DMs aren't using prepackaged modules for their campaign worlds. They are using their own, others, cannibalizing, and generic ones that they "shoe-horn" into their worlds. This would suggest the negotiated IP with publishers might be a separate issue than the sharing of info where the demand truly is. Now not suggesting that anyone's submissions don't require protecting, but I would think that is a bit more simplistic than the IP / Licensing dealing with the publishers. Now economically, there would certainly be the cash flow that LW needs from the publishers that may not be equaled by private submission.
I just found it odd that the snippet of attendees and their wants, needs, and use was contrary to what RW has been working these last few years toward.
For myself, I'm unlikely to purchase pre-made publisher items since my world (Greyhawk) has been shelved by hazbro for some time now. I would be more likely to use it to swap with other "GHers" or game mechanic piece if I used the content market at all. So the market has far less value for me than the other items that have been continually deferred.
How did you see the one you attended?
The flip side, of course, is that GMs who want to use prepackaged content can't do so with the current version. Until there's a means and a sufficient amount of available content, they may not be interested in Realm Works at all.
It makes me wonder what the responses would have been at panels for other products. (Also whether they could draw more than 22 people out of the 60,000-80,000 who attended.)
Hope you had a good time at the con! Mine was mildly disappointing, but that's how it goes.
It makes me wonder what the responses would have been at panels for other products. (Also whether they could draw more than 22 people out of the 60,000-80,000 who attended.)
Hope you had a good time at the con! Mine was mildly disappointing, but that's how it goes.
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I think the concern is that the present users of RW are only those who do it themselves.
The crowd, which IME is the majority of GM's, who buy everything and simply run what they buy have no use for RW until they can buy modules and AP's in RW format so why would they even go to as RW seminar?
If you want a taste of the numbers difference go to the PFS ballroom or D&D AL hall at the next GenCon. Ask around in there. Many of those guys play nothing but the organized play campaign and even the ones who play outside of it still only play pre made stuff. The number of GM's who custom make their own worlds and adventures is really quite small.
The crowd, which IME is the majority of GM's, who buy everything and simply run what they buy have no use for RW until they can buy modules and AP's in RW format so why would they even go to as RW seminar?
If you want a taste of the numbers difference go to the PFS ballroom or D&D AL hall at the next GenCon. Ask around in there. Many of those guys play nothing but the organized play campaign and even the ones who play outside of it still only play pre made stuff. The number of GM's who custom make their own worlds and adventures is really quite small.
Dark Lord Galen
Well-known member
True and as PArody pointed out its certainly due to the lack of a means to share that info.
Well, maybe. But would also add that many utilize conventions and seminars to get a peak on upcoming events, items etc... so IMO I don't think it's a good measure for lack of attendance but lack of interest. Again, the other telling part (as Parody mentions) was only 22 chose to attend out of 60k? certainly a deflating forecast in any perspective.
Now to flip that part of the debate its not like all 60 could attend if they did chose to... ( I think the capacity was 50-75 maybe?) but fairly possible if the interest were high enough that Gencon would have located it to a larger venue... donno....
Actually I did, since Anna was working up in the ballroom, I spent several hours discussing Realmworks and Herolab with those in line to print PC sheets. And to add most had interest in Herolab and what it could do, but 1 in hundred even asked about RW and most of those were indifferent at best even when pointing out the good features it does possess (ie auto linking, etc). As Anna is a personal friend I tried to be supportive as a third party in those "sales" conversations but most that asked while waiting in line have never heard of RW or have heard or reviewed too many of the drawbacks of campaign management aspects mentioned at nauseum here (lack of viable print options, real time updating, calendars, even 32bit platform were only a few of the mentioned items). So it was hard to be neutral or positive around those other than to say " working on it and soon".
And while that is certainly true in a convention atmosphere, its all the more reason why they would have little need for Realmworks as a "campaign manager" but moreso as a game manager, thus not needing the majority of supporting items we here have been waiting patiently for.
just 2cp
Dark Lord Galen
Well-known member
Yea it was good, though did more walking than I am accustom to. hehe.... hell to get old..
Good
Taking several of my players that had never been to a convention for gaming was the real reward for me. That and the combination of visiting with old friends in the industry I have known or corresponded with for years.Though would have certainly like to have added a few new names to that list like yourself.
Bad
Some of the seminars were terrible. Makes me wonder what the screening process was.
The worst of which was one I sat in just because it fit a window between two others in the same hotel so I decided what the heck....
It was a good idea for beginners that became a bad seminar compounded by the comments of an unqualified speaker.
Readers digest was "gaming improv" is not "acting improv". There are as many similarities as their are differences. Actors seldom act sole sitting at a table for hours and having to also create the "imaginary visuals" to go along with the persona they are projecting.
But the real (insert LOUD annoying buzzer noise here) was the speaker suggesting that you should "NEVER create a persona that is not your own or very similar ethnicity". REALLY?? When I questioned this for clarity, the speakers reasoning is "it would be considered offensive." REALLY??? Sorry I declared that was totally incorrect.
I have had many varied people across a broad multicultural background sit at my table and this has never been an issue... I can't even fathom telling my spanish player that he can no longer use his "sudo-japanese voice" for his samurai character as it is offensive simply because spanish people stereotype japanese ones to sound like saturday morning kungfu theater (don't we all as far as that goes)???? REALLYYYY???? OMG its a game, Entertainment...
*Rant over* lol.. anyway.....
Ugly
We might have to do a better job here in the community for communicating who is going to events and have a bit of face time together.
Just 2cp
?
How precisely should I run Saturdays game? One of the personas I need to take on is a thousand year old dragon. Anyone know any millennia old hexapedal sentient flying reptiles available on short notice? I'll talk to my Satanist friend about the devil in next weeks game but really this is going to get expensive.
I think the CM being so far behind schedule and the lack of any other new features in so long has hurt adoption.Well, maybe. But would also add that many utilize conventions and seminars to get a peak on upcoming events, items etc... so IMO I don't think it's a good measure for lack of attendance but lack of interest. Again, the other telling part (as Parody mentions) was only 22 chose to attend out of 60k? certainly a deflating forecast in any perspective.
HeroLab is pretty common in the Pathfinder community IME so getting RW to the point where there is an RW download of every AP, module and PFS adventure when it is released would go a long way to getting that community to adopt it. Hopefully the method of securing files is something that can be easily deployed so that Paizo and other publishers can deploy it on their sites. If GM's start seeing the option to but PDF and RW bundles right on Paizo's site that will make them more likely to buy RW in the first place.
Dark Lord Galen
Well-known member
ROFLMAO... now that made me snort coffee OWWW lol
As to support of RW, I would agree, though I don't utilize PF personally (except cannibalizing Ultimate Campaign ideas)
FWIW, I (almost) never attend seminars/panels at a gaming convention. I'm there to play and run games, typically ones that I don't get to play/run at home. I expect them to be a tough sell in general, but maybe that's just me.
I believe the screening process is similar to the screening process for any other event type; very little.
I believe the screening process is similar to the screening process for any other event type; very little.
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GenCon's gotten better in recent years. Seminars are pretty much only done by industry types. I knows that's not a particularly high bar but its still better than years past.
I attended some seminars where I literally found myself correcting the moderating on some pretty basic stuff.
I attended some seminars where I literally found myself correcting the moderating on some pretty basic stuff.