Vault monsters always seem to have something incorrect
 

I've been running a 2e game recently (5 sessions now) and I've noticed that almost every single monster I import from the vault has something wrong that I need to manually correct. I began to notice this on my 3rd session.

Typically it's been AC, attack bonuses, and DC's. Sometimes the creatures level is wrong/missing, and adjusting that corrects it. Sometimes I just need to add 1 AC or attack bonus. The time I noticed an incorrect DC I had no way to adjust it, and just had to remember. Everything that has been incorrect, has only been incorrect by 1.

Has anyone else noticed this?

I haven't reported any bugs on this yet, as it seems silly to submit a bug report for every single monster.

which monsters, specifically? were they from Bestiary 1, 2, or both?

I'm pretty sure I've seen it in both. Virtually all of them had problems. I filed a bug report on the first few, but it really seems like a systemic problem—if they solve one of the AC problems, they'll likely solve them all.

They all look correct in the summary when you find them in the Vault. Once imported to my cast or scene, the AC is almost always different by 1. As nightpanda said, sometimes the issue is attack bonus or DCs. But I've seen the most problems with AC.

I haven't deleted my old scenes, so I went through them all. Using Archives of Nethys for reference. I checked one or 2 against the books in-session and they matched the Archives.

All the ones I've seen so far have been B1.

Zombie Brute: Attack bonus off by 2.
Kobold Dragon Mage: Claw attack off by 4. Arcana by 1. Dragon lore by 1.
Kobold Scout: AC off by 1, Saves by 1, Attacks by 1, Skills by 1, Crafting by 3. (This guy's level says 0, but its 1)
Kobold Warrior: AC off by 1, Sling attack by 4, Spear melee by 3, Spear ranged missing.
Spider Swarm: AC off by 1, Athletics is reversed (-2 instead of +2).
Hunting Spider: Level is 0, so anything level based off by at least 1. Hunting spider venom DC off by 1.
Hobgoblin Soldier: Level is 0, so anything level based off by at least 1.
Cockatrice: Calcification DC off by 1, AC by 1.
Goblin Warrior: AC off by 1
Animated Statue: AC off by 1.
Gray Ooze: This one looks fine.
Shadow: AC off by 1.
Vampire Spawn: AC off by 1, Athletics 1, Intimidation 1, Society 8.
Skeletal Champion: AC off by 1.
Skeleton Guard: AC off by 1, Athletics 1.
Skeletal Giant: This one looks fine.


Bonus:
Zombie Hulk: Hunk of Meat attack bonus off by 8.

That's A LOT of discrepancies. My combat prep times have basically doubled, since I now need to double-check everything.

Good catch, didn't notice myself until now.

yikes, now i'm paranoid that i've been using the wrong numbers in the game i'm running. i'll double-check everything when i get home tonight. thanks for bringing this up! :eek:

if i were you i'd file a single bug report with all the info you've posted here. like mototom said, it seems like a systematic issue.

ok i checked and yes, i'm seeing the same issue. the monster stats are listed correctly in the preview pane on the Import From Vault menu, but once the monster is imported to the campaign cast the stats change! weird.

did you submit a bug report?

Haven't gotten around to it yet. Probably in the next few days.

I've submitted a few for the AC changes.

I have seen this as well. I have not had time to report them as of yet myself, as they are sometimes hard to spot until I am in the middle of a session. But Best 1 has quite a few.

This is something we're actively looking into. A fair bit originates from adjustments made between the B1 release and when monster creation rules were put out in the GMG, and some are just issues lol. But yeah, we're working to address it and make corrections.

Great to hear, thanks!

Great news!

Should we report individual issues as we find them, group them in multiples, or something else?

Multiples are fine, that way Ryan isn't swamped. Just hold off for the time being, if all goes well we're shooting to roll out changes soon (not today's release, but very near future) which should correct a fair deal of the issues, so any reports currently aren't going to do much good as they're already being worked on.

Just rolled out fixes this week that corrects a bunch of discrepancies, so hopefully things are looking better. If you find issues now go ahead and shoot us bug reports for them. Thanks!

Wow, thanks for the quick turnaround on this! I took a glance and the numbers are definitely looking much better. Saw a few small discrepancies but those can go in individual bug reports. Thanks again.

Just a heads up that something seems to have gone amiss here, but we're investigating it.

Alright, we just released the fix for this. Basically NPC ancestries now have internal modifiers to skills to match their statblock values instead of including values in the adjustments boxes by default, so the values entered there should be exclusively what you guys enter. There was a problem that happened with applying the fix that would modify those adjustment values opposite what we had used though, so things were extra weird there. This has now been corrected though, so any new NPC that's created or imported from the Value should have no modifications applied, and any existing ones should have their values adjusted to maintain status quo. There's a note in our release notes about a window of cases where values will be incorrectly applied, unfortunately, but we did the absolute best we could to get this fixed and minimize impact on you all with it.

Alongside this we get a change to the UI made to display final values properly in their appropriate tables, which was oddly missing, but woo improvements. Like I said before, if you run into any issues, let us know!

Kobold Scount
 

I'm having this same issue with the kobold scout. I select Basic NPC/Monster, and select Kobold, Kobold Scout from the level 1 section. None of the details it returns are correct apart from setting the ability scores correctly. I'm seeing an AC of 2, Perception of +4, etc... Nothing matches up about from the ability scores.