Before I purchase this addon, I'm wondering the final decision made on how this content was added, especially since it replicates/changes/updates some material found in other previously released sources. Did LW decided to make these separate content? For example, if I pick the Lore Warden archtype for my Fighter, will I see 2 options or only the option from AG? Thanks.
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- The Lone Wolf Development Team
Adventurer's Guide Implementation
- Thread starter Krothos
- Start date
Speaking as someone who did a good 1/2 or so of the work on this book, there is a bunch of stuff that has been updated from what appeared in earlier sources.
In some cases, new archetypes/classes has to created due to the degree of differences with the old material. In these cases the old version is kept but renamed with the sourcebook it originally appeared in. For example there is a new version of the Steel Talon in the AvG, but the one from the Andoran book is still there but renamed to Steel Talon (Andoran).
In other cases the class/archetype is just renamed, for example the old Lantern Bearer ranger archetype is renamed to the Lantern Defender.
FYI, there is also a bunch of new classes and archetypes in the book that have not appeared elsewhere.
In some cases, new archetypes/classes has to created due to the degree of differences with the old material. In these cases the old version is kept but renamed with the sourcebook it originally appeared in. For example there is a new version of the Steel Talon in the AvG, but the one from the Andoran book is still there but renamed to Steel Talon (Andoran).
In other cases the class/archetype is just renamed, for example the old Lantern Bearer ranger archetype is renamed to the Lantern Defender.
FYI, there is also a bunch of new classes and archetypes in the book that have not appeared elsewhere.
It's possible that section just isn't finished yet, as we noted in our release: the Houses of Perfection and Lantern Bearers sections are not yet complete, and will be added in a future update.
Other people consider us updating things to the latest rules to be a service. It's all tradeoffs, Dwayne. Unfortunately things didn't go your way this time, sorry.
I kinda feel a bit like Dwayne, and felt things should have stayed the same from other material. Further on that, I don't remember seeing anything official from Paizo that these duplicated items in AG are actual updates/errata to previous sources. Is this official Paizo errata (if so, from where/whom) or just a decision of LW team?
Perhaps that could be a project for the community files?
I requested a copy of the original items (because they are from non-core sources they cannot be copied) but my requests where ignored. Moving them to a community project would be an ideal solution.
Lord Magus
Well-known member
They cannot be copied, but can be recreated by transcribing the original. If you still have an older, pre-AdvGui version of the PF files, install it in a newly created folder to have access to those original items in that system's editor.
They can be copied via LW staff. Transcribing these is asinine, LW should be able to release a copy of them for the community. Having to re-code a bunch of items when it has already been done, is a waste of time easily avoided.
I'll bring the idea up to my boss, but I am a bit uncomfortable with the precedent that would set.
Pathfinder is now pushing 10 years of existence, Dwayne. It's not a long stretch at this point to think that they'd start making changes. If you like the old version of something you can just add it into Hero Lab as a variant option yourself in the editor. There is nothing to keep you from adding the older version if that's your preference. Its not a perfect "Fix" but you can always get the prior version readded and get it into the community packs for everyone to use.
Aaron,
I understand your point of view, but you need to remember that some game masters will not switch the new version of class as soon as its out. Keeping depreciated versions of changed material would help people who might choose to keep running the old version of a class. I know this may sound odd coming from me, but over the 5e playtests the "Revised" ranger class has had many mixed reviews. I'd be pretty miffed myself if they updated it in a future release and my software accounted for the change without keeping the original. Especially when Mr. Mearls originally called it a variant class. If a Gamemaster doesn't like or agree with the changes in a revision, they have a Rule 0 right to rule a player cannot use it. For consistency keeping the old versions as community data pack data might be helpful.
I talked it over with Colen, and we don't think it's a good idea to give out old data files on demand. If you feel a particular thing from Avg should have been split rather than updated, you can submit a bug report and we'll take a second look, or you can reproduce them yourself and perhaps submit them to the community files. Hope that helps!
ShadowChemosh
Well-known member
To be perfectly honest I am not sure I want to open that door either. Maintaining a whole separate set of Classes/Feats/Abilities would suck. I can see where lots of issues with Pre-Req and Archetypes will cause problems and error reports. It means trying to "trick" HL into thinking these "Custom" versions are the same as the "Real" versions.
I quickly see this not being maintained by the person who wants it and dropping it in my lap. I can't speak for anyone else but I simply have NO time to add this to the my current work load. Sorry....
