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Azhrei
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Old November 26th, 2017, 11:52 AM
There are a lot of people here who have more experience with the various Paizo source books than I have, so I beg your help.

In a game a couple days ago, two rogues in our party were invisible and moved to surround an enemy mage and take them out. The GM said my attack would be a regular attack, albeit with the benefits of being invisible, but that it wouldn't be a coup de grace since the target wasn't "helpless". That's fine, but it meant the three rounds spent getting into position were rather wasted since the rogue could've been more proactive against other combatants.

So here's my plan for next time. I will buy three small sacks with leather straps used to cinch the openings. While invisible, I'll pull the sack over the head of the target from behind them. It would be easy enough for the target to pull the sack off, so I want to put some kind of spring-loaded "fishing reel" on the leather strap that will suck up all of the slack. In an ideal world, it would work like a wind-up clock, where a key is used to coil the spring by turning it clockwise, and inserting the key and turning counterclockwise would release the ratchet. The device would be attached to the inside of the sack so that the target couldn't get to it easily.

Here's my problem: we're playing by PFS rules, so I cannot craft anything custom. Does anyone know of a device similar to the spring-loaded reel that I described that already exists in Golarion that would be acceptable under PFS rules? I know the concept exists, because of the spring-loaded wrist sheath, I just need something that will spool string or twine or thin leather strips...

Thanks in advance!
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Farling
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Old November 26th, 2017, 03:27 PM
Try the technology guide, that's where all the "high tech" complicated that breaks the high-fantasy approach resides.

P.S. the sack over the head still doesn't render him "helpless", since isn't any of "paralyzed, held, bound, sleeping, unconscious, or otherwise completely at an opponent’s mercy" - he's just got a sack over his head making him blind.

Now if one of you hit him with a paralysis effect, then the other could get in that coup de gras...

Farling

Author of the CSV2RW tool (http://forums.wolflair.com/showthread.php?t=58156)

Last edited by Farling; November 26th, 2017 at 03:31 PM.
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Minous
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Old November 26th, 2017, 04:16 PM
With PFS rules what you are trying to do just wont work. Best case you could get a monk with the grapple feat chain and get them pinned in 1-2 rounds which would render them helpless. Otherwise as a rogue get flanking and beat the crap out of them.
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Farling
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Old November 26th, 2017, 04:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Minous View Post
With PFS rules what you are trying to do just wont work. Best case you could get a monk with the grapple feat chain and get them pinned in 1-2 rounds which would render them helpless. Otherwise as a rogue get flanking and beat the crap out of them.
Or Great Invis if you can't get flanking :-)
Or learn Feint.

Farling

Author of the CSV2RW tool (http://forums.wolflair.com/showthread.php?t=58156)
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Azhrei
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Old November 26th, 2017, 04:58 PM
Hey, thanks for the ideas! (Hm, looks like the technology guide is going to be stuff that’s not valid in PFS.)

We’re only 5th level right now, so fancy stuff isn’t readily available yet, although I am hoping to get some greater invisibility from our mage... I do have ideas for future use, though.

The bag over the head won’t allow coup de grace, you’re right, but it means they’re blind and I can sneak attack them!

(I was thinking of letting my familiar loose inside the bag as well. It’s a greensting scorpion. I’m just worried my little buddy could get hurt. )

Last edited by Azhrei; November 26th, 2017 at 06:01 PM.
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ErinRigh
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Old November 26th, 2017, 08:53 PM
2 levels man, Gr Invis becomes available in 2 levels
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Farling
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Old November 27th, 2017, 12:59 AM
Points in Bluff, get Improved Feint feat, then a move action give you your feint attempt and if successful then your immediately-following attack has them denied their bonus to dexterity (therefore sneak attack applies).

I've been doing that in our latest campaign, and is great fun!

Or carry a coin with Silence cast on it :-)

Farling

Author of the CSV2RW tool (http://forums.wolflair.com/showthread.php?t=58156)
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Azhrei
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Old November 27th, 2017, 08:31 AM
Hm, two more levels...

I’m actually building an archer. My plan is to use obscuring mist and fogcutter lenses (or a Goz mask) and sneak attack from within the mist. I’ll be taking Deadly Range a few times so that I can get my range up to 60’, and the Snap Shot tree so that anyone who tries to approach me in the mist gets mowed down.

(If anyone knows of a more “personal” version of obscuring mist or similar, I’d like to hear. I know there’s an ability available on legendary weapons that provides a 5’ version of obscuring mist, but again, this is PFS... I just don’t want to get in the way of the rest of the party, if I can avoid it.)

I took a single level of wizard and the Magical Knack trait so I have CL3. I have vanish and feather fall that I keep prepared at all times, with a wand of gravity bow and a wand of shield.

Thanks again for all of the ideas. I checked out the Technology Guide for ideas, even though it isn’t PFS, but didn’t find anything helpful for my “bag over the head” technique.
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Minous
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Old November 27th, 2017, 08:37 AM
Its expensive, but sniper googles + Goz mask = Sneak at OMG ranges.

Since your using UMD I would also recommend using the spell storing ioun stones. If you have an arcane caster in the party get a pearl of power (or equivalent) and have them cast Obscuring mist into it. Means you dont have to roll UMD.

Last edited by Minous; November 27th, 2017 at 08:40 AM.
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Azhrei
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Old November 28th, 2017, 06:42 AM
Hm, I hadn’t seen sniper goggles, I’ll have to look into that. Thanks.

Nope, no UMD. That’s why I took a level of wizard. I am putting a few points into UMD for easy access to clerical wands, but I don’t expect to use UMD much for combat purposes...
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