Organizing Pathfinder Content

[EightBitz]

Those of you who have entered Pathfinder content, how have you organized races and classes?

I think my least favorite option is creating a source for each rulebook and containing the relevant articles under their respective rulebooks.

I'm thinking of either:

Creating a race container for each rule book (so each container would contain only the races for that rulebook) or creating a tag for each rule book, and assigning the appropriate tag.

I think I'm leaning towards the last option, as that would be more universal. I can use that same tag for classes and spells.

How have others done this?

[Silveras]

Depending on your sources, you can call the Pathfinder Reference Document the sole source for all of the content from the main RPG line.. because all of the books get added to it eventually.

In my own efforts, I *am* entering them with a Source book as the parent... purely in order to make entry more organized. I fully intend to merge them all at some point. This approach is particularly useful, I think, for spells and Bestiary entries.

Rather than tagging, I use the Suffix to hold the book name. Now that Bulk Tagging is an option, it will be easier to add tags to the topics I have already entered to give credit to the individual books, if I decide to go that route.

Races... I have disagreed with Rob on this before. I see value in having Race entries in both the Mechanics and the World sections. Mechanics has the game-effects of the race, while the World has the history and setting-specific characteristics of the Race.

[EightBitz]

Originally Posted by Silveras

Depending on your sources, you can call the Pathfinder Reference Document the sole source for all of the content from the main RPG line.. because all of the books get added to it eventually.

In my own efforts, I *am* entering them with a Source book as the parent... purely in order to make entry more organized. I fully intend to merge them all at some point. This approach is particularly useful, I think, for spells and Bestiary entries.

Rather than tagging, I use the Suffix to hold the book name. Now that Bulk Tagging is an option, it will be easier to add tags to the topics I have already entered to give credit to the individual books, if I decide to go that route.

Races... I have disagreed with Rob on this before. I see value in having Race entries in both the Mechanics and the World sections. Mechanics has the game-effects of the race, while the World has the history and setting-specific characteristics of the Race.

How do you handle things like Catfolk that appear in both the Advanced Race Guide and a Bestiary book?

[rob]

We're doing it BOTH ways. Plus a third.

There are advantages with each approach that are purely complementary. There are times you want to view material from the perspective of BookX, in which case having a container for the book is highly useful. There are times you want to filter, in which case tags are perfect. And there are times you want everything jumbled together while still being able to instantly identify where something comes from, so that's when the suffix comes in quite handy. As such, we're doing all three.

That last scenario isn't going to arise commonly right now. However, we've got a feature coming that will leverage it heavily for a lot of usability, especially when it comes to things like spells, gear, feats, etc.

Obviously, doing it all three ways is more work, so you'll need to weigh the ROI for each and make the tradeoffs that best match how you'll use the material.

On the specific subject of races, there are two aspects to a race. There is the mechanical side of a race, which is what gamers primarily think of as a "race" - and what the rulebooks tend to emphasize for them. There is also the story side of a race, as @Silveras points out. To make things as natural as possible, the term "race" should be used in RW in a way that's consistent with how it is primarily perceived by users. So that's why we put the "Race" category on the mechanics side. Using the same term for two different categories, in two different places, is only going to foment confusion. So it's a bad idea (IMO) to also have a "Race" category on the story side. That's why we introduced the "Group: Ethnic" category on the story side quite a while back. That's exactly where all the story-side material for a race belongs within our model, plus it's more generalized to handle ethnicity beyond just race.

So we've specifically put into place a framework that enables anyone to readily employ the approach that @Silveras is advocating here. And I'm pretty sure that some of @Silveras' past comments on the subject fueled this addition.

One last thing. You can rename categories, so there is nothing stopping anyone from renaming the "Group: Ethnic" category to "Race" and having them both named exactly the same, if that's what you happen to want.

[Silveras]

Originally Posted by EightBitz

How do you handle things like Catfolk that appear in both the Advanced Race Guide and a Bestiary book?

That's why I don't plan to keep the content arranged by book long-term.

Multiple things .. races and classes ... have gained additions in multiple books. New Rage Powers for Barbarians, new Bloodlines for Sorcerers, new Rogue Talents, and so on. Organizing these by book would actually be counter-productive for me in the long-run.

For things like classes and races, I "credit" the book in a general list. So I have a "Base Classes" General Article to serve as the Container for all Base Class Articles... and that header lists "from the Core Rulebook: Barbarian, Bard, ..." in a snippet for each book. Base Classes, Prestige Classes, and Alternate Classes each get a "Header" article under the main "Classes" article.

Races get Race Articles. The Monster entry from the Bestiaries gets a separate Monster Article entry. So, Catfolk would have both, with sepearate uses/purposes. Monster Articles are sorted into alphabetical grouping headers ("A", "B", "C", etc.) and have the specific Bestiary in the Suffix. EDIT: There's no reason not to make use of Realm Works' inherent flexibility and redundant options to put them to work representing the same thing in different ways for different uses. This is also something I have done with Locations...a general Location entry for a well-known place, with its common information included -- and a matching Adventure Site Topic with the encounters and such for a specific adventure.

At present, all of this is done in Realms that I have viewed as experimental.. so they are not all consistent. I am hoping to use the Import/Export to move the Mechanics out of them (as one is for Rise of the Runelords, and the other is for Second Darkness) to create a consolidated Pathfinder Rules Realm that I can re-use.

I view the PRD as a great resource, except that it is organized by book, which means you often have to know, or have an idea, of where to start in order to find something. So for me, a single Realm with all of the content mixed is preferable, and treating the PRD as a single source goes a long way toward that.

Having said all of that, what I am doing is for my own use (and any players in my games). I don't have to worry about making something that would confuse others without me being there to explain the rationale, and so on. So as long as I want to put in the effort to do things "my way", I can customize it as I like.. which would not be the case if it was something for sale.

[EightBitz]

Originally Posted by Silveras

That's why I don't plan to keep the content arranged by book long-term.

Multiple things .. races and classes ... have gained additions in multiple books. New Rage Powers for Barbarians, new Bloodlines for Sorcerers, new Rogue Talents, and so on. Organizing these by book would actually be counter-productive for me in the long-run.

For things like classes and races, I "credit" the book in a general list. So I have a "Base Classes" General Article to serve as the Container for all Base Class Articles... and that header lists "from the Core Rulebook: Barbarian, Bard, ..." in a snippet for each book. Base Classes, Prestige Classes, and Alternate Classes each get a "Header" article under the main "Classes" article.

Races get Race Articles. The Monster entry from the Bestiaries gets a separate Monster Article entry. So, Catfolk would have both, with sepearate uses/purposes. Monster Articles are sorted into alphabetical grouping headers ("A", "B", "C", etc.) and have the specific Bestiary in the Suffix. EDIT: There's no reason not to make use of Realm Works' inherent flexibility and redundant options to put them to work representing the same thing in different ways for different uses. This is also something I have done with Locations...a general Location entry for a well-known place, with its common information included -- and a matching Adventure Site Topic with the encounters and such for a specific adventure.

At present, all of this is done in Realms that I have viewed as experimental.. so they are not all consistent. I am hoping to use the Import/Export to move the Mechanics out of them (as one is for Rise of the Runelords, and the other is for Second Darkness) to create a consolidated Pathfinder Rules Realm that I can re-use.

I view the PRD as a great resource, except that it is organized by book, which means you often have to know, or have an idea, of where to start in order to find something. So for me, a single Realm with all of the content mixed is preferable, and treating the PRD as a single source goes a long way toward that.

Having said all of that, what I am doing is for my own use (and any players in my games). I don't have to worry about making something that would confuse others without me being there to explain the rationale, and so on. So as long as I want to put in the effort to do things "my way", I can customize it as I like.. which would not be the case if it was something for sale.

Well, sure. :-) I'm not going to try to resell Pathfinder. Just poking around for ideas. :-)

[Silveras]

Originally Posted by EightBitz

Well, sure. :-) I'm not going to try to resell Pathfinder. Just poking around for ideas. :-)

Yep.. I'm just pointing out the main reason why I sometimes stray from how the official content is being prepared.

[kbs666]

This is theoretical because I'm not entering all of that myself but:

If I was going to I'd enter the PRD with each book's section on a particular race/class getting snippets tagged by book inside the greater article. I'd really want only a single article on barbarians, for instance, and I'd want all the FCB's from all the sources in one section. The snippet tags would let me identify which book(s) a particular thing came from if/when I needed to look something up.

I hope at least one of the PRD's produced for RW does things that way.

[EightBitz]

Originally Posted by kbs666

This is theoretical because I'm not entering all of that myself but:

If I was going to I'd enter the PRD with each book's section on a particular race/class getting snippets tagged by book inside the greater article. I'd really want only a single article on barbarians, for instance, and I'd want all the FCB's from all the sources in one section. The snippet tags would let me identify which book(s) a particular thing came from if/when I needed to look something up.

I hope at least one of the PRD's produced for RW does things that way.

Well, I'm still job hunting, so I'm not planning to buy anything official until I have gainful employment.

[Merion]

For races, I have a stub machanics article, where the rules parts sit. But my main topic for any given race is in the world almanach as an ethnic group. There I describe what makes them tick, how their society works, how they see the world, et cetera. This tends to be the more interesting stuff for my players than the basic rules which they (and I) can look up in the books on the table or on their phone.