Mac User

[chiefweasel]

Actually, I abandoned using my Mac for PC applications. Instead I went out and got a cheap Windows 8.1 PC and have installed RW on it. Along with several other PC only programs I use.

[Tekwych]

Originally Posted by mezme

Tekwych, you will not mess your mac if you run a VM software on it. You do need a reasonably recent mac, enough HD space and about 4 more Gig of RAM more to do it with reasonable performance do. I use Parallels but I hear good things from VM fusion.

Oh, I know. I am a systems engineer that specializes in Macintosh solutions. I just have no interest in adding Windows when I am using a far more stable and powerful OS already. I will wait for a native Macintosh application just as I did with Hero Lab.

I'm just disappointed that cross platform integration was not considered from the beginning, especially in this day and age of touch based operating systems. Cross platform APIs that allow data to be seen from any device or OS seam to be a core value for this product but were left behind.

[rob]

Originally Posted by Tekwych

I'm just disappointed that cross platform integration was not considered from the beginning, especially in this day and age of touch based operating systems. Cross platform APIs that allow data to be seen from any device or OS seam to be a core value for this product but were left behind.

Actually, we DID seriously consider cross-platform. Our #1 priority was ultimately migration from Windows to a web-based solution, so we needed a cross-platform solution that provided that. We also wanted a Macintosh solution. So we did our research and concluded that .Net was the best approach, since native Windows and web-based were readily supported, plus Mono existed as a solution for the Mac. We eschewed some simpler and more powerful Windows-side options (e.g. WPF) to ensure that we'd be able to migrate to Mono.

Alas, the Mono project team has thus far chosen not to support a few of the key .Net mechanisms we rely upon. So our plan has been undermined by external factors that are outside our control and that we could not foresee when we made our technology stack choices.

After we get V1.0 out, we'll be re-assessing how to get something native into place for the Mac platform.

[Bobson]

Originally Posted by rob

Alas, the Mono project team has thus far chosen not to support a few of the key .Net mechanisms we rely upon. So our plan has been undermined by external factors that are outside our control and that we could not foresee when we made our technology stack choices.

What aren't they supporting? I've been trying to push a Mono project at work, rather than a remote-desktop based solution, but I thought they covered just about everything that wasn't directly a UI.

[Tekwych]

.net is five years behind systems like rails and will always lead you to the brick walls that you are hitting. The system was designed to be a closed loop and not an open structure.

[rob]

Originally Posted by Tekwych

.net is five years behind systems like rails and will always lead you to the brick walls that you are hitting. The system was designed to be a closed loop and not an open structure.

Back at the start of 2010, we needed to choose a cross-platform solution that provided (a) native Windows support, (b) native Mac support, and (c) a smooth transition to a web-based solution. Can you cite a solution that was proven and established for all three of those objectives back then?

We've spent years developing Realm Works. We had to make a choice roughly 4 years ago regarding the technology stack we would leverage, and I certainly don't remember Rails being a proven viable candidate back then - it may have been, but my memory is quite foggy. We also had to factor in our in-house familiarity with development tools, since going with something completely new would have meant an even steeper and more complex development effort. As I mentioned earlier, our priorities positioned (a) and (c) as required, with (b) being highly desirable. Given those priorities, and combined with our established expertise with Microsoft tools and technologies, .Net proved to be the best avenue.

You're welcome to play armchair quarterback and judge our decisions all you want. But it's disingenuous to cast aspersions and claim that "core values" were "left behind". You may not agree with the choices we made, but I consider it rude that you would claim we never considered the options without at least asking us first. They were absolutely weighed, and we made the best decision based on our established priorities and the information we had at the time.

We may not be able to provide a native Mac solution right now, but we still support the most widely used desktop/laptop platform (Windows) and are on course for fully supporting every device via a web-based solution (including the Mac). So I consider the choices we made to have been solid, even if you believe something else might POSSIBLY have been slightly better.

Debating the decisions we made four years ago is basically academic at this point and takes my attention away from getting code written. So I need to re-focus back on that task and it seems we'll just have to agree to disagree on this point.

Thanks!

[rob]

Originally Posted by Bobson

What aren't they supporting? I've been trying to push a Mono project at work, rather than a remote-desktop based solution, but I thought they covered just about everything that wasn't directly a UI.

There are some key omissions that we've run into. I'll need to go dig up that information again from our last Mono assessment, which was at least six months ago. If you don't see an answer here in by the weekend, ping me again. I'm juggling a zillion things right now and find myself dropping the non-critical stuff with some regularity.

[timjthomas]

Originally Posted by rob

Back at the start of 2010, we needed to choose a cross-platform solution that provided (a) native Windows support, (b) native Mac support, and (c) a smooth transition to a web-based solution. Can you cite a solution that was proven and established for all three of those objectives back then?

We've spent years developing Realm Works. We had to make a choice roughly 4 years ago regarding the technology stack we would leverage, and I certainly don't remember Rails being a proven viable candidate back then - it may have been, but my memory is quite foggy. We also had to factor in our in-house familiarity with development tools, since going with something completely new would have meant an even steeper and more complex development effort. As I mentioned earlier, our priorities positioned (a) and (c) as required, with (b) being highly desirable. Given those priorities, and combined with our established expertise with Microsoft tools and technologies, .Net proved to be the best avenue.

You're welcome to play armchair quarterback and judge our decisions all you want. But it's disingenuous to cast aspersions and claim that "core values" were "left behind". You may not agree with the choices we made, but I consider it rude that you would claim we never considered the options without at least asking us first. They were absolutely weighed, and we made the best decision based on our established priorities and the information we had at the time.

We may not be able to provide a native Mac solution right now, but we still support the most widely used desktop/laptop platform (Windows) and are on course for fully supporting every device via a web-based solution (including the Mac). So I consider the choices we made to have been solid, even if you believe something else might POSSIBLY have been slightly better.

Debating the decisions we made four years ago is basically academic at this point and takes my attention away from getting code written. So I need to re-focus back on that task and it seems we'll just have to agree to disagree on this point.

Thanks!

Good answer Rob. I am a Mac user and have picked up Parallels to play around with RW. While it doesn't yet meet my needs (I need to be able to install without Admin rights), the product is quite powerful and I appreciate all the work you guys have put into it.

Thanks again for all the work!

I hope it can someday be a solution I can use fully. Until then, I have supported financially and will continue to "play around with it."

[rob]

Originally Posted by timjthomas

While it doesn't yet meet my needs (I need to be able to install without Admin rights), the product is quite powerful and I appreciate all the work you guys have put into it.

Please help me to understand what's necessitating the ability to install without Admin rights. Perhaps there's an alternative work-around that can be exploited to get you fully running with the product...

[weogarth]

Originally Posted by rob

Please help me to understand what's necessitating the ability to install without Admin rights. Perhaps there's an alternative work-around that can be exploited to get you fully running with the product...

Rob, somewhere in one of his posts, he was mentioning wanting to use it at work on his lunch break.