Special Characters and Vanilla lists

[Lordhat]

I've been patiently waiting for somebody to notice that it's actually legal for a vanilla list to have a chapter special character. I.E. A "vanilla" Raven Guard list of at least 1500 points MAY have Captain Shrike in the list. AB flags this as "presence invalid". Could somebody please change this with the next update.

[harkan]

Dont be patient ... let us know about it!!

Once we know we can get it fixed, head over to www.ab40k.org and log it into the SM bug tracker, thanks

[jlong05]

Is there such a thing as a 'vanilla' Raven Guard list? Isn't that a Raven Guard list?

[Ghaz]

Originally Posted by jlong05

Is there such a thing as a 'vanilla' Raven Guard list? Isn't that a Raven Guard list?

Page 45 of Codex Space Marines, second paragraph in the grey box 'Chapters Of Legend'.

[jlong05]

Ah, missed the very last sentance stating a no traits is valid. interesting.

[Profile]

I think this is intentional. If you read that whole sentence, not the last half of it. "Using the normal space marines army list without chapter traits is always a valid option." Shrike isn't in the normal army list, he's a special character. Just like my Ultramarines, they can be ultra marines in color, but take traits if I wanted them to be just another codex chapter and I liked the blue color scheme... If i'm taking traits then I can't get Tyranid hunters, Calgar, Honor guard ect... because they are a fluffy bit of the True Ultramarines chapter. So if you want to use the chapter specific guys you have to go with the specific codex definition for that chapter ie traits. So I get no traits. If you have "Vanilla" raven guard, all you have essentially is a standard army list chapter which happens to share the raven guard colors etc... This is a case of "you gata buy the cow to get the milk" not a "why buy the cow if i can get the milk for free". Shrike being the Milk. That said, he's mighty kickass and I'd love to have him in my army... but I'm playing smurfs. It's the rules you use that restrict your special characters, not the color they are painted.


Or I could be totaly wrong.

[Profile]

I checked again, if you select Raven guard as your chapter and "No divergence" it is saying you are "not diverging" from their listed entry traits. Give it a shot if you want to add in 5 assault squads it will let you, you just have to select any squad over three and it will give you the option to "Count as Elite". It's automatically adding in the traits when you select a "Chapter of Legend" To get it Vanilla as you say you will have to select "Codex Chapter" from the army list, and that option does not allow any special characters. Instead of characters you get the ability to tweak your own makeup of traits to specialize your force providing more Tailor'd battle forces.

[Ghaz]

Ultramarines have no traits to begin with. A valid Raven Guard list would be one that uses the traits listed on page 45 of the codex or no traits at all.