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Farnaby
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Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 108

Old October 3rd, 2017, 10:01 AM
Well if you call criticism toxic, that's your call.

I just hope that someone from LWD is listening to us.
Farnaby is offline   #31
Toblakai
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Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 453

Old October 3rd, 2017, 10:18 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dark Lord Galen View Post
Not True, and sorry your 140 or so posts and a user since 2016 hardly qualifies you to make such an assumption as to "higher end" here. When long time users even begin to voice their dissatisfaction, LWD should take notice. These are the people that their business lifeblood depends on. Not to imply new users don't or shouldn't have a voice, they should, but not all voices carry the same weight. The survey should have taught LWD that lesson. (whole other topic there)
Seriously? Throwing forum cred around? That is the point I bought RW, I bought hero lab many years before that. Been a lurker most of the time.
Toblakai is offline   #32
Dark Lord Galen
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Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Texas
Posts: 705

Old October 3rd, 2017, 10:34 AM
Welcome to the Unsilent Minority....

D&D> Pre 1e White Box Edition, 1e, 2e, 3.5 Currently, Set in the World of Greyhawk (The first, longest running and Best Campaign Setting)
Software>Extensive use of all forms of MS Products, Visual Studio 2012, DAZ 3d, AutoCAD, Adobe Products.
Gaming Specific>Campaign Cartographer, D20 Pro Alpha & BattleGrounds Beta Tester, World Builder, Dungeon Crafter, LWD Hero Lab, Realm Works, Inkwell Ideas Citybuilder & Dungeon Builder, Auto-Realm, Dundjinni
Contributing Writer for TSR, WOC, & Canonfire
Dark Lord Galen is offline   #33
Toblakai
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Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 453

Old October 3rd, 2017, 10:35 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dark Lord Galen View Post
Welcome to the Unsilent Minority....
Do I get a "Dark Lord" title now too?
Toblakai is offline   #34
Dark Lord Galen
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Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Texas
Posts: 705

Old October 3rd, 2017, 10:49 AM
While that would earn you credence on the Word of Greyhawk forum (canonfire.com) here it might have the reverse effect. I have spent time in the basement of Rob's doghouse on more than one occasion.

BUT since you did confess for your predilection to lurking from the Shadows... we bestow on thee the unofficial moniker of Lurker of Shadows

As your unsilence experience grows and you take up the herald banner of Calendar-seeker... then we, the faithful calendar heralds, will look at a "level-up"...
Maawwaahhhaaa....

DLG

D&D> Pre 1e White Box Edition, 1e, 2e, 3.5 Currently, Set in the World of Greyhawk (The first, longest running and Best Campaign Setting)
Software>Extensive use of all forms of MS Products, Visual Studio 2012, DAZ 3d, AutoCAD, Adobe Products.
Gaming Specific>Campaign Cartographer, D20 Pro Alpha & BattleGrounds Beta Tester, World Builder, Dungeon Crafter, LWD Hero Lab, Realm Works, Inkwell Ideas Citybuilder & Dungeon Builder, Auto-Realm, Dundjinni
Contributing Writer for TSR, WOC, & Canonfire
Dark Lord Galen is offline   #35
ShadowChemosh
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Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Chicago, IL (USA)
Posts: 10,730

Old October 3rd, 2017, 11:04 AM
The thread may not have been as toxic and hostile as many gaming sites have had. No one directly threatened to kill Rob or his family but it still served no useful purpose.

Everyone knows the CM is late including LW and having yet another thread filled with a echo chamber of complaints does nothing. Plenty of sites exist for this purpose already like Facebook or Twitter.

Its pretty clear that the only valid date is "when its done". Pretty much everyone has a simple choice. They walk away from RW and its products or you accept what the software does "today" is helpful for you. The software as is with import/export is just about perfect for myself. I still run into some bugs but so far I can fix them all myself.

The deletion of the thread should also clearly show the level of frustration on the LW side. At my own job customer service reps that deal with the "end" customer is in a totally different building. I personally never have to deal with the "hate" that is spewed at customer service. Good or bad my company keeps this separate for a reason as it prevents the drag down of all employees. In addition my work place has a huge HR staff dedicated to making the work environment safe, happy, professional and a "positive" place. This is because few people actually enjoy a day filled with negative emotions. The impact to performance is staggering when people are not happy. Hmmm anyone remember Rob being sick for many months now?

LW has no such protection. Every employee has to engage the community directly on TOP of doing their normal jobs. I am pretty sure few of us would stay at our own jobs if we had to deal with the general public all the time. I would totally want to drill a hole in my head if I had to deal with it for my day job!

I am not even free of adding to the problem myself. I have had to face the truth that a few things I posted where not really helpful but just empty complaints. Its something I plan to correct and maybe its not a bad idea for everyone to take a moment to reflect on what they write BEFORE they hit the "submit" key. Its really easy on forums/internet to forget that another human with feelings is reading what you wrote. Not an empty emotionless company.

Hero Lab Resources:
Pathfinder - d20pfsrd and Pathfinder Pack Setup
3.5 D&D (d20) - Community Server Setup
5E D&D - Community Server Setup
Hero Lab Help - Hero Lab FAQ, Editor Tutorials and Videos, Editor & Scripting Resources.
Created by the community for the community
- Realm Works kickstarter backer (Alpha Wolf) and Beta tester.
- d20 HL package volunteer editor.
ShadowChemosh is offline   #36
meek75
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: Louisville, Ky
Posts: 330

Old October 3rd, 2017, 11:25 AM
I just want to point that my original post (now deleted) was not only a complaint about the lack of communication and the loooooonnnnnnnggggggg time it has taken for CM. My primary complaint was the lack of customer service response I was getting to fix my sync failure. When CM was used as the excuse for the slow service it pushed my already sensitive buttons. I honestly feel like I only get the attention of LWD when I either send them a frustrated email or make it public on the boards. Obviously I have more issues that most of you. Probably because my groups plays lots of different games and that means I have lots of realms. If each each realm had one issue a year I would be dealing with 12 or 13 issues. Of course, I should not have to deal with so many issues and if I do I want to get them fixed. If an MS Word document became corrupted every few months through no fault of my own I would be mad and I would be using google sheets. Am I expecting too much from LWD? I have thought about that a lot, and I don't think I am. At this point I will not be buying cloud service and I will not be buying HLO. I no longer trust LWD to deliver a quality product or to deal with problems that come up. This may change. I hope it changes. For now, I will use the realms I have, but will not invest more time in them. I will not buy anything that cost more than a few bucks from the CM if it ever does launch. Tomorrow will make three weeks since I first submitted a help ticket for my sync failure. I have only gotten reply when I email them asking for an update. All the replys have been short and basically said "keep waiting". Several people have said I should move on, and I am quickly coming to the same conclusion.
meek75 is offline   #37
Dhrakken
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Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Mississauga, ON, Canada
Posts: 103

Old October 3rd, 2017, 11:30 AM
Shadowchemosh, you are a well respected member of this community and everyone respects your opinion however, I have to politely disagree with you. You see, as a consumer and customer, it is my right to express my displeasure at an organization, be they big or small. I've been working in the customer service industry for over 30 years and having to deal with customer dissatisfaction, while unpleasant, is part of what you sign up for when you are selling a product or service. They go hand in hand, no organization can escape this.

Now, how you deal with those complaints is what will dictate your long term viability as a company. The most important thing you can do is to listen to your customers and acknowledge them; if you don't... well you do so (or don't) to the detriment of your organization.
Dhrakken is offline   #38
Dark Lord Galen
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Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Texas
Posts: 705

Old October 3rd, 2017, 11:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShadowChemosh View Post
The thread may not have been as toxic and hostile as many gaming sites have had. No one directly threatened to kill Rob or his family but it still served no useful purpose.
Shadow, with NOTHING but the upmost respect, I disagree... IF and only IF someone, anyone, on either side, can glean a viable solution through communication to not have the issue to begin with... I think the origin of the thread is a symptom of a larger problem, a lack of communication. Not at meeting targets, but as to what got us here in the first place. Certainly all add to that by their own perspectives of "other late items", but as again a symptom of the core problem they all have in common. Communication or as in this case a lack of. Whether that is response timing to fixing a problem (where this thread started), to here is where we are and what we have in front of us for obstacles and solutions.. good communication is KEY.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShadowChemosh View Post
Plenty of sites exist for this purpose already like Facebook or Twitter..
True, but even less likely to resolve the core problem on the countless sites that would be. What better place than where one would hope to get those answers... AGAIN only if their is communication. And as you so rightly hint, to rant that produces nothing will fix nothing, but a vent unresolved.



Quote:
Originally Posted by ShadowChemosh View Post
I am not even free of adding to the problem myself. I have had to face the truth that a few things I posted where not really helpful but just empty complaints. Its something I plan to correct
Ditto, hence why I have slowed my responses almost to nil, other than informative or information seeking, and most of those have been on the HL side. A promise I made to Liz before her departure. But I admit, as a left brained-engineer type its hard to left things unfixed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShadowChemosh View Post
and maybe its not a bad idea for everyone to take a moment to reflect on what they write BEFORE they hit the "submit" key. Its really easy on forums/internet to forget that another human with feelings is reading what you wrote. Not an empty emotionless company.
WELL PUT... by someone that certainly has "forum cred" (new phrase I learned today)

And certainly brings another thought to the surface... ID no problem without also presenting a solution....
For me, surely as a company LWD has an action Items list (or a variant of).
Doesn't have to be code jargon, or extended narrative. Bullets would certainly suffice that there is a movement to a goal, obstacles found, or identified or resolved and communicate that to those that support your efforts. We (well I hope all) are vested in the success of RW and LWD that within itself makes us passionate.. @ LWD Let us help you help us...

BUT AGAIN as Shadow reminds us, there are people on the other end too.

Andwith my 600th Post, I hope it is well spent...

D&D> Pre 1e White Box Edition, 1e, 2e, 3.5 Currently, Set in the World of Greyhawk (The first, longest running and Best Campaign Setting)
Software>Extensive use of all forms of MS Products, Visual Studio 2012, DAZ 3d, AutoCAD, Adobe Products.
Gaming Specific>Campaign Cartographer, D20 Pro Alpha & BattleGrounds Beta Tester, World Builder, Dungeon Crafter, LWD Hero Lab, Realm Works, Inkwell Ideas Citybuilder & Dungeon Builder, Auto-Realm, Dundjinni
Contributing Writer for TSR, WOC, & Canonfire

Last edited by Dark Lord Galen; October 3rd, 2017 at 12:00 PM. Reason: added clarification to first comment underlined
Dark Lord Galen is offline   #39
Toblakai
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 453

Old October 3rd, 2017, 12:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dhrakken View Post
Shadowchemosh, you are a well respected member of this community and everyone respects your opinion however, I have to politely disagree with you. You see, as a consumer and customer, it is my right to express my displeasure at an organization, be they big or small. I've been working in the customer service industry for over 30 years and having to deal with customer dissatisfaction, while unpleasant, is part of what you sign up for when you are selling a product or service. They go hand in hand, no organization can escape this.
Totally your right to voice your displeasure. it is not your right to do it on their forums. That is a privilege they grant to the users (or not).
Toblakai is offline   #40
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