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Valyar
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Old March 9th, 2018, 11:07 PM
The logic that bulk prunes and tags articles is there. Links clean and re-scan is just another operation that can be handled by it.

Also just because you won't use a feature, does not mean it should not be there. Tomorrow you might end up in the same situation.

The past is a rudder to guide us, not an anchor to hold us back.
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kbs666
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Old March 10th, 2018, 04:11 AM
Wanting to clear every link in a realm and relink? Never. Why would I ever want to do that.. Scan for new links sure. I was a big proponent of the feature but I completely fail to see the benefit of actually clearing existing links.

my Realm Works videos
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCZU...4DwXXkvmBXQ9Yw
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Valyar
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Old March 10th, 2018, 11:43 AM
Below are some examples from a realm, that i am working on for 6 months. I hope I am clear enough, as i had no sleep and soon my mind will shut down. I work in the IT and if I have to do a task more than once I will script it. Here the same principle applies. Realm Works is already having a fabulous foundation to implementing it again (we agree that there is already bulk prune and tag).

Example 1: You have article named "Temperance". Later you add second one named "Sons of Temperance".

Unfortunately you have many topics that already contain the string "sons of temperance", but only "temperance" is linked as it was the only article existing back then.

This makes the links wrong and you want to fix it. If I have to do it once or twice - sure. But when it comes to dozens of pages - not so OK.

Example 2: In the life of your realm, you might end up creating articles with the same name - one in Mechanical section, one in the World section. Again, because you created those at different times and the linking was done in a mixed way, you want to make the links "right" and prune.

Example 3: Same as above, but you rename article and add "the" in front (or other stuffs). If you allow RW to automatically change the link in hundreds of articles, you are screwed, as there will be for sure another "the" here and there. Better wait 5 min to rescan the whole thing than suffer the manual link fix.

On example 3 i can copy the original article, delete it and rename the copy of it. This is dirty trick that does not scale well.

I hope I managed to make you see my point of view

The past is a rudder to guide us, not an anchor to hold us back.
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kbs666
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Old March 10th, 2018, 04:38 PM
No, you did not. All examples are extremely contrived.

You are asking for a feature that, based on what I know of the existing feature, would take a lot of developer time to get and I simply doubt it would get used by more than 1 in 1000 users and then rarely.

Your desire seems to be derived from having used the CSV tool rather than entering data by hand. Pouring a lot of stuff into RW will never equate to entering data by hand and using the program to run games. This is why I've always been very skeptical of this whole idea.

my Realm Works videos
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCZU...4DwXXkvmBXQ9Yw
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Valyar
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Old March 10th, 2018, 10:07 PM
The examples are not contrived but experienced first hand. All about articles in the world almanac related to the world - adventures, setting information, organizations and etc. A realm for me is living document, can't get perfect or final from the beginning and the more tools you have to manipulate large amount of data/obejcts, the better. Especially if it is obvious that such logic is already implemented in the program at many places.

On the frequency of the usage - yes, it is something that might be low compared to other. Here comes the product owner and the priority that will be assigned in the product's backlog (if it even gets there).

Lets see what happens when (or if...) LW resume their work on the product.

The past is a rudder to guide us, not an anchor to hold us back.
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kbs666
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Old March 11th, 2018, 05:19 AM
Your examples:

The only reason all instances of "temperance" would be linked including those in "sons of temperance" is because you had set it to auto. That is your own fault. Auto is a bad idea. You should always manually review every link. This is one of the main reason I'm very skeptical of the CSV tool. You dump so much material into RW at once it is too tempting to simply auto accept all the links.

Links to topics and articles with the same name. Again would never happen except by auto linking. I have many cases of the same name in my realm, even topics with the same name, and I have never felt the need for this.

Adding an article to a topic name? Either you do or you don't do this. Again this is only a problem if you have imported a lot of text you didn't author yourself by a tool that let you do it without even reading the material.

The problem boils down to you misused the bulk import tools provided by someone else and now you have a realm that is a mess and you want the devs to give you the tools to get you out of it. Since the rest of us are waiting for other features we've needed for years that would make running our games better and make actually using RW in the ways most of use RW better I don't think this feature should ever be a priority.

my Realm Works videos
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCZU...4DwXXkvmBXQ9Yw
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Farling
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Old March 11th, 2018, 08:40 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kbs666 View Post
Your desire seems to be derived from having used the CSV tool rather than entering data by hand. Pouring a lot of stuff into RW will never equate to entering data by hand and using the program to run games. This is why I've always been very skeptical of this whole idea.
With mechanics in particular, there is usually no reason to go through the long and tedious method of entering all the data by hand.

Farling

Author of the CSV2RW tool (http://forums.wolflair.com/showthread.php?t=58156) and the RW Output tool (http://forums.wolflair.com/showthread.php?t=59981)
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kbs666
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Old March 11th, 2018, 08:58 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Farling View Post
With mechanics in particular, there is usually no reason to go through the long and tedious method of entering all the data by hand.
I've long argued there is little to no point in entering mechanics at all.

my Realm Works videos
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCZU...4DwXXkvmBXQ9Yw
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Valyar
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Old March 11th, 2018, 09:50 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kbs666 View Post
The problem boils down to you misused the bulk import tools provided by someone else and now you have a realm that is a mess and you want the devs to give you the tools to get you out of it.
Quote:
Again this is only a problem if you have imported a lot of text you didn't author yourself by a tool that let you do it without even reading the material.
Today I had long flights and transits, quite irritated, so I am not sure on the "tone" of your post. I give the benefit of the doubt that you are not going offensive and just let you know that none of the assumptions and the conclusion are correct. Apologies from my side if I misinterpreted your intention.

If you don't like the feature, just don't vote, simple as that. Developers will decide what goes in the backlog.

Quote:
I've long argued there is little to no point in entering mechanics at all.
Is there thread on that, I find this interesting - no mechanics at all?

The past is a rudder to guide us, not an anchor to hold us back.

Last edited by Valyar; March 11th, 2018 at 09:58 AM.
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Farling
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Old March 11th, 2018, 11:07 AM
There are many ways to use the tool, and different people use the tool to store different sorts of information.

There is no right or wrong way to use the tool.

For those who use the tool in a particular way, then having built-in support to help them is always good.

Farling

Author of the CSV2RW tool (http://forums.wolflair.com/showthread.php?t=58156) and the RW Output tool (http://forums.wolflair.com/showthread.php?t=59981)
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