AB40k future?

Sir_Lunchalot · August 16th, 2012, 09:56 PM

Hey, so I just read this:

http://www.ab40k.org/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=2148

So what happened? did the ab40k maintainers get a new, nastier legal threat?

Peanutt · August 17th, 2012, 09:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sir_Lunchalot

Hey, so I just read this:

http://www.ab40k.org/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=2148

So what happened? did the ab40k maintainers get a new, nastier legal threat?

I would have to say knowing GW that you are not far from the truth.

fyrebyrd · 08:41 PM

For any further insight, jlong stated it best here.

GodHead · 07:16 AM

Game rules are not subject to copyright. Game rules cannot be patented, although in certain jurisdictions, game mechanics can be patented. An example of a mechanic is the Magic the Gathering "tap" mechanic, which is one of the most well known game mechanics subject to a patent in the United States. Even if patented, it's the use or application of the patented mechanic that is contrary to the owner's rights, not the publication thereof. In fact, to obtain a patent, the owner has to make the mechanic publicly available in the patent registry. Canada specifically forbids patents based on board games, although the US and UK allow limited patenting in the case of novel mechanics following the standard tests for originality and non-obviousness.

US:
http://www.copyright.gov/fls/fl108.html

Canada:
http://www.cipo.ic.gc.ca/eic/site/cipoin...l#whatcant

UK:
http://www.ipo.gov.uk/types/copy/c-applies.htm

An interesting article from games designer's point of view:
http://www.gamesdiner.com/2009/08/game-r...ted-by-law

GW can send threatening letters all they want, but they aren't backed by anything. The fact that forums/individuals cave in means nothing except those individuals don't understand the law or don't have a spine to stand up for themselves.

Points costs, unit stats, and rules descriptions are all fair game. GW doesn't own any interest in any of those. What they have is a protection of their specific expression as published in their literary works.

And although I am not providing legal advice, in any way, I am a lawyer and very familiar with copyright and intellectual property issues.

I am fully within my rights to say the following:
A Leman Russ Battle Tank in the Imperial Guard Codex costs 150 points, has Armour Value 14 on the front, Armour Value 13 on the sides, Armour value 10 on the rear. It comes equipped with a Battle Cannon on the turret, as well as a hull mounted Heavy Bolter. It has a searchlight as well as smoke launchers standard. It has a number of options including... bla bla bla sponsons... equip, etc. You get the idea.

GW has never made the above specific expression, so they can't prohibit its publication.

Their C&D letters are a scare tactic. That said, they may file a nuisance law suit, and you probably wouldn't be able to afford to fight it properly, even if it is totally without merit.

Someday, I'd like to see someone, somewhere, stand up to them. Too many forums and other sites just immediately comply with their frivolous demands, which actually infringes on our consumer rights.

Bounty · August 20th, 2012, 08:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GodHead

GW can send threatening letters all they want, but they aren't backed by anything. The fact that forums/individuals cave in means nothing except those individuals don't understand the law or don't have a spine to stand up for themselves.

...

Someday, I'd like to see someone, somewhere, stand up to them. Too many forums and other sites just immediately comply with their frivolous demands, which actually infringes on our consumer rights.

This isn't entirely true. Their letters are backed up not by law, but by a cadre of highly trained, very expensive, lawyers. They may not be able to legally stop something, but they can smother it to death in legal proceedings and legal fees until the target of their wrath is nothing but a bankcrupt, quivering mass of something that used to be a man.

And that's provided the courts don't commit yet another act of monumental stupidity and side with GW. All it would take is 1 case where what you said isn't upheld to give the GW legal department the foothold it needs to crush things even further.

Limey_ElJonson · August 20th, 2012, 11:22 AM

I would be willing to put money into a fund to aid the ab40k maintainers should they obtain legal counsel.

Limey_ElJonson · August 20th, 2012, 06:35 PM

If we all stand up for these guys it'll be easier. I'd gladly put money into the hat to help the ab40k maintainers pay for a lawyer.

gmerrick · August 21st, 2012, 06:56 PM

Well, if this starts becomming a problem, I would suggest that someone start up a http://www.indiegogo.com fundraiser to help legal defense for these folk. Also if they were to speak with the lawyer that assisted Matt Innman recently, he may be able to provide advice on this.

If a legal defense fun on indiegogo were to gain sufficient funding, it may give the lawyers at GW pause to reconsider their actions.

RavenX · 10:50 PM

GW is a money hungry entity in and of itself. Most of its business decisions are made not by the people that do the models, or codexs and army books, but by the Marketing Department. Marketing has a huge strangle hold on everything GW does. Which is why no new armies are coming out. Marketing looks at short term profit not the long haul (because the employees working that department average 1 - 3 years in the company and move on to better paying jobs). They see $ Million loss for 5 years on a new army as a problem, and don't look at ten years down the line when its churning a profit for the company. They are the reason that many of the old army lists were broken up and put into other books (any else remember Chaos Dwarves?). This is the same company that also raises prices every couple years because "it is time to do so." I love Warhammer for all it is but I have my frustrations with the company because Marketing has a leash on everything the designers want to do. They only care about making money right now, and they'll do what they need to do to make it. Their marketing department is very short sighted in terms of profitability. All the "scare tactics" amount to is GW saying 'we want our share of the money' because that is all their marketing department is about right now. Basically they're Tyranids eating wallets and money.

darkwolf33333 · August 28th, 2012, 10:08 AM

Hi guys,

I have been a 40K player for just two years, brought into it by my partner who has been playing it for eight years. He has used army builder from the start as does many of our friends. When I heard about this abuse I immediately called my two close friends who are lawyers and asked if GW can do this, turns out they cant, and GodHead is right. This type of bullying needs to stop. I created a petition on Change.org for us players to send a message to GW that we will no longer stand for this type of abuse as players. Please read the petition, sign it, and tell your friends.

I might be new to 40k, but as it stands right now, what they are doing is tyrannical and needs to stop.

Link: http://www.change.org/petitions/game...d-army-builder

Sir_Lunchalot Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Posts: 2 August 16th, 2012, 09:56 PM	Hey, so I just read this: http://www.ab40k.org/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=2148 So what happened? did the ab40k maintainers get a new, nastier legal threat?
#1

fyrebyrd Senior Member Volunteer Data File Author Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Lebanon, PA, USA Posts: 144 August 17th, 2012, 12:09 PM	For any further insight, jlong stated it best here. Fyrebyrd AB40k Beta Tester The only "hobby" GW is interested in is lining their pockets with your money. Last edited by fyrebyrd; August 17th, 2012 at 08:41 PM.
#3

Limey_ElJonson Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 2 August 20th, 2012, 11:22 AM	I would be willing to put money into a fund to aid the ab40k maintainers should they obtain legal counsel.
#6