Digest Number 485

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There are 16 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1. Re: Orks - Lootas vehicle options
From: Versif <petark@ntlworld.com>
2. Re: Serious Update Problems
From: Rob Bowes <rob@wolflair.com>
3. Re: Orks - Lootas vehicle options
From: "-= JIMI =-" <james.tubman@btinternet.com>
4. Re: Orks - Lootas vehicle options
From: Colen 'Skrillboy' McAlister <demandred@skrill.org>
5. Re: Orks - Lootas vehicle options
From: Colen 'Skrillboy' McAlister <demandred@skrill.org>
6. Re: Orks - Lootas vehicle options
From: "-= JIMI =-" <james.tubman@btinternet.com>
7. Re: Orks - Lootas vehicle options
From: "-= JIMI =-" <james.tubman@btinternet.com>
8. RE: Suggestion
From: "DiPonio" <DiPonio@voyager.net>
9. Re: Orks - Lootas vehicle options
From: "Shawn Campbell" <shawn@electricstitch.com>
10. Re: Orks - Lootas vehicle options
From: "Xaxier" <Xaxier@blueyonder.co.uk>
11. Re: Orks - Lootas vehicle options
From: "-= JIMI =-" <james.tubman@btinternet.com>
12. Re: Orks - Lootas vehicle options
From: "Xaxier" <Xaxier@blueyonder.co.uk>
13. Re: some AB Lite questions
From: "Russell Sparkes" <rjs@inorbit.com>
14. Re: Restricting options based on unit size
From: "Shawn Campbell" <shawn@electricstitch.com>
15. Re: Restricting options based on unit size
From: Rob Bowes <rob@wolflair.com>
16. Re: Restricting options based on unit size
From: "Shawn Campbell" <shawn@electricstitch.com>


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Message: 1
Date: Tue, 21 Aug 2001 21:03:15 +0100
From: Versif <petark@ntlworld.com>
Subject: Re: Orks - Lootas vehicle options

In this article -= JIMI =- <james.tubman@btinternet.com> wrote
>> On a related note KOS ors can only ever take one looted rhino since the
>> mandatory addition of grot riggers takes them to 51+ points.
>
>Arent Grot Riggers classed as a vehicle upgrade (albeit mandatory for KoS)
>and not an inherent part of a Rhino?? Thus you should be able to take a
>looted Rhino at 50pts but it automatically gets the riggers and changed to
>52pts??

Indeed, so you can only take one in a KOS army since it is the cost of
the vehicle and any upgrades that count not the base price of the
vehicle.

Cheers

Grotfang, not so humble ork warlord.


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Message: 2
Date: Tue, 21 Aug 2001 13:06:52 -0700
From: Rob Bowes <rob@wolflair.com>
Subject: Re: Serious Update Problems

Please make sure that you have up-to-date drivers for your printer
installed. If you are using older drivers or drivers for a slightly
different printer model, you might run into this problem. You should be
able to download the latest drivers for free from the web-site of your
printer manufacturer.

Thanks, Rob


At 08:02 PM 8/20/2001 +0000, you wrote:
>I'm now experiencing one more problem that I'm not sure is related or
>not. When I select "Print Roster" or "Print Summary" it gives me the
>following error msg:
>"Program has performed as illegal operation and will be shut down."
>
>I know it sounds like a system problem, but it has never done this
>before, and I only get it when I try to print things in AB!
>Anyone else experiencing this or similar problems?



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Message: 3
Date: Tue, 21 Aug 2001 21:24:43 +0100
From: "-= JIMI =-" <james.tubman@btinternet.com>
Subject: Re: Orks - Lootas vehicle options

> Indeed, so you can only take one in a KOS army since it is the cost of
> the vehicle and any upgrades that count not the base price of the
> vehicle.

IMO, the vehicle is bought as per the standard Looted Vehicle rules but
automatically get Grot Riggers as per Orky vehicle upgrades.


Jimi

FREE 40k card scenery - http://www.crosswinds.net/~astronomican/
My Ebay Auctions - http://members.ebay.co.uk/aboutme/astronomican/

40k3 - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/40k3/
40k Fluff - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/40k_fluff/
Astartes - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/adeptus_astartes/
Grey Knights - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/greyknightchapter/
Imperial Guard - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/imperial-guard/
Sons Of Russ - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sons-of-russ/
Unforgiven - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unforgiven/
VDR - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gw-vdr/




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Message: 4
Date: Tue, 21 Aug 2001 19:30:09 +0100
From: Colen 'Skrillboy' McAlister <demandred@skrill.org>
Subject: Re: Orks - Lootas vehicle options

At 19:13 21/08/2001 +0100, you wrote:

>On a related note KOS ors can only ever take one looted rhino since the
>mandatory addition of grot riggers takes them to 51+ points.

It's the base cost of the vehicle, not the cost after upgrades etc., that
matters.


--
Colen 'Skrillboy' McAlister, demandred@skrill.org
http://www.skrill.org/, http://www.incompetence-central.co.uk/
1 = 2, for large values of 1.



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Message: 5
Date: Tue, 21 Aug 2001 18:57:39 +0100
From: Colen 'Skrillboy' McAlister <demandred@skrill.org>
Subject: Re: Orks - Lootas vehicle options

At 18:25 21/08/2001 +0100, you wrote:
> > > 'black codex'??
> >
> > The "black codex" is the lists at the back of the main rulebook. The main
> > rulebook is black.
>
>A-ha - I see!! Arent those army lists in the rulebook redundant when the
>relevent codex is available??
>
>Because if they arent then the ability to upgraded a looted Basilisk with
>Indirect Fire no longer exists as it only appears in the IG codex and not
>the rulebook.
>
>You cant have it both ways - either use the rulebook army lists or use the
>codexes.

The Q&A specifically says they can use the Indirect Fire upgrade. That's a
good point, though; the looted vehicles shouldn't be able to take the Smoke
Launchers. The normal Loota unit still uses the black codex lists, because
it specifically states that the units should come from the "Warhammer
40,000" rulebook.


--
Colen 'Skrillboy' McAlister, demandred@skrill.org
http://www.skrill.org/, http://www.incompetence-central.co.uk/
1 = 2, for large values of 1.



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Message: 6
Date: Tue, 21 Aug 2001 22:07:51 +0100
From: "-= JIMI =-" <james.tubman@btinternet.com>
Subject: Re: Orks - Lootas vehicle options

> The Q&A specifically says they can use the Indirect Fire upgrade.

Thats because its refering to the codex entry, not the Black Codex entry.

> The normal Loota unit still uses the black codex lists, because
> it specifically states that the units should come from the "Warhammer
> 40,000" rulebook.

Whereas thats very true, GW do make the claim that rulebook army lists will
become invalid when codexes are released.


Jimi

FREE 40k card scenery - http://www.crosswinds.net/~astronomican/
My Ebay Auctions - http://members.ebay.co.uk/aboutme/astronomican/

40k3 - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/40k3/
40k Fluff - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/40k_fluff/
Astartes - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/adeptus_astartes/
Grey Knights - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/greyknightchapter/
Imperial Guard - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/imperial-guard/
Sons Of Russ - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sons-of-russ/
Unforgiven - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unforgiven/
VDR - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gw-vdr/




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Message: 7
Date: Tue, 21 Aug 2001 22:08:34 +0100
From: "-= JIMI =-" <james.tubman@btinternet.com>
Subject: Re: Orks - Lootas vehicle options

> >On a related note KOS ors can only ever take one looted rhino since the
> >mandatory addition of grot riggers takes them to 51+ points.
>
> It's the base cost of the vehicle, not the cost after upgrades etc., that
> matters.

Thats the way I (and my Orky opponents) see it.


Jimi

FREE 40k card scenery - http://www.crosswinds.net/~astronomican/
My Ebay Auctions - http://members.ebay.co.uk/aboutme/astronomican/

40k3 - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/40k3/
40k Fluff - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/40k_fluff/
Astartes - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/adeptus_astartes/
Grey Knights - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/greyknightchapter/
Imperial Guard - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/imperial-guard/
Sons Of Russ - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sons-of-russ/
Unforgiven - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unforgiven/
VDR - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gw-vdr/




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Message: 8
Date: Tue, 21 Aug 2001 17:35:09 -0400
From: "DiPonio" <DiPonio@voyager.net>
Subject: RE: Suggestion



-----Original Message-----
From: Colen 'Skrillboy' McAlister [mailto:demandred@skrill.org]
Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2001 1:25 PM
To: ab@support.wolflair.com
Subject: Re: [AB] Suggestion

At 16:52 21/08/2001 +0000, you wrote:
>Hello
>
>A short suggestion. I play 40K and I miss a note in Armybuilder which
>tells me what kind of Choice the unit is. If I play against Eldar and
>there is Rangers in the Army, I want to see if it is a Troop choice
>or a Elite choice. Can this be done?

Ah yes, it has been since AB2.2 has come out I think. The only problem is,
once it's been added, it will be tricky to turn off.

A question to everyone: Would this be a valuable thing to have in the 40k
files, or should it be an opt-in basis only (i.e. an extra file you have to
download)?

I think it would be nice to have.
TP


--
Colen 'Skrillboy' McAlister, demandred@skrill.org
http://www.skrill.org/, http://www.incompetence-central.co.uk/
1 = 2, for large values of 1.


To unsubscribe from this group, email

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Message: 9
Date: Tue, 21 Aug 2001 15:01:46 -0700
From: "Shawn Campbell" <shawn@electricstitch.com>
Subject: Re: Orks - Lootas vehicle options

> The Q&A specifically says they can use the Indirect Fire upgrade. That's a
> good point, though; the looted vehicles shouldn't be able to take the
Smoke
> Launchers. The normal Loota unit still uses the black codex lists, because
> it specifically states that the units should come from the "Warhammer
> 40,000" rulebook.

I believe the codex should overrule the 40,000 rulebook. In this case, the
Ork codex was written before the IG codex (IIRC), and so you had to
reference the black book. Now that we have the IG Codex, it should be used
instead of the rulebook.

-Shawn



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Message: 10
Date: Tue, 21 Aug 2001 23:11:41 +0100
From: "Xaxier" <Xaxier@blueyonder.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Orks - Lootas vehicle options

Yeh, but it was written after the Space Marine Book, and it still say's to use the Black Codex.

------------------------------------
David

aka Master Xaxier - Sons of Promethus Space Marine Chapter
aka Farseer - Ul'rad Salatcan
aka Gorglum - Night Goblin Warlord
aka far to many people.

Quotes (got a laugh at this one)

***note to list members: don't flame setzer on this thread, that's my job! if you want to start a "Flame Setzer" thread, go ahead.***" - Greg Sheard

"Nobody is going to start *any* "Flame ________" thread, especially not one about me." - Erik
----- Original Message -----
From: Shawn Campbell
To: armybuilder@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2001 11:01 PM
Subject: Re: [AB] Orks - Lootas vehicle options


> The Q&A specifically says they can use the Indirect Fire upgrade. That's a
> good point, though; the looted vehicles shouldn't be able to take the
Smoke
> Launchers. The normal Loota unit still uses the black codex lists, because
> it specifically states that the units should come from the "Warhammer
> 40,000" rulebook.

I believe the codex should overrule the 40,000 rulebook. In this case, the
Ork codex was written before the IG codex (IIRC), and so you had to
reference the black book. Now that we have the IG Codex, it should be used
instead of the rulebook.

-Shawn


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Message: 11
Date: Tue, 21 Aug 2001 23:15:38 +0100
From: "-= JIMI =-" <james.tubman@btinternet.com>
Subject: Re: Orks - Lootas vehicle options

> Yeh, but it was written after the Space Marine Book, and it still say's to
use the Black Codex.

GW like doing cock-ups - ref: stormbolters on Chaos Rhinos :-)


Jimi

FREE 40k card scenery - http://www.crosswinds.net/~astronomican/
My Ebay Auctions - http://members.ebay.co.uk/aboutme/astronomican/

40k3 - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/40k3/
40k Fluff - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/40k_fluff/
Astartes - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/adeptus_astartes/
Grey Knights - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/greyknightchapter/
Imperial Guard - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/imperial-guard/
Sons Of Russ - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sons-of-russ/
Unforgiven - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/unforgiven/
VDR - http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gw-vdr/




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Message: 12
Date: Tue, 21 Aug 2001 23:35:08 +0100
From: "Xaxier" <Xaxier@blueyonder.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Orks - Lootas vehicle options

It was actually done that, way because it meant u didnt need to buy the other codexes to use the options, that simple.

David


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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Message: 13
Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 00:13:53 -0000
From: "Russell Sparkes" <rjs@inorbit.com>
Subject: Re: some AB Lite questions

--- In armybuilder@y..., "Josh Liller" <JL_Stinger@y...> wrote:
> 1) In the Necromunda, I can't for the life of me find the
> Exterminator upgrade for Redemptionist weapons. Where is it listed?

If you read the FAQ for Necromunda (Start Army Builder, create your
gang and go to the Help menu and select Necromunda FAQ) you will see
this question answered. To save you any extra effort required for
those extra few mouse clicks, I'll repeat the info here (you REALLY
should have read the FAQ first :-)

"The Exterminator Cartridge can be added to any allowed weapon by
adding the weapon to the gang member, selecting the weapon from the
main screen and selecting the Exterminator Cartridge in the Options
panel (Just like Weapon reloads and the One In a Million options)"

Enjoy,
Russell.
----
Russell Sparkes - rjs@inorbit.com - http://www.freecfm.com/r/rjs
"Experience is what you get just after you needed it" - Unknown



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Message: 14
Date: Tue, 21 Aug 2001 20:33:41 -0700
From: "Shawn Campbell" <shawn@electricstitch.com>
Subject: Re: Restricting options based on unit size

Rob,

I was hoping to make it not allow increasing past, but this will do.

Your suggestion worked great.

Thanks,
-Shawn

----- Original Message -----
From: "Rob Bowes" <rob@wolflair.com>
To: ab@support.wolflair.com
Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2001 1:05 PM
Subject: Re: [AB] Restricting options based on unit size


> If you are using the "rang" attribute to control the selection count for
> both options, you can't solve this directly. The trick to solving this is
> to use a separate hidden stat in the background. Start with a hidden stat
> named "Beta". When Option Beta is increased, use "base" to increase the
> value of "Beta". Then use the "lcmp" unit attribute to verify that the
> value of "Beta" is less than or equal to the model count of the unit. You
> now have validation for Option Beta.




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Message: 15
Date: Tue, 21 Aug 2001 22:23:23 -0700
From: Rob Bowes <rob@wolflair.com>
Subject: Re: Restricting options based on unit size

One of my goals with AB was to enforce things via validation and NOT with a
hammer. There are WAY too many groups with their own house rules,
especially for special one-of games and/or campaigns they create. If AB
forced users to comply with all the rules, then it would be a hindrance for
games that relaxed some of those rules. With validation, the errors are
flagged but can be easily ignored by mutual agreement of the players.

There are probably lots of situations where you can't have AB force the
user to comply, but there is usually a way to have AB flag an error via
validation. Personally, I think this is the optimal way to write data files
that are useful to everyone, even those with their own house rules.

Just something to keep in the back of your mind while writing data
files.... :-)

Hope this helps,
Rob


At 08:33 PM 8/21/2001 -0700, you wrote:
>Rob,
>
>I was hoping to make it not allow increasing past, but this will do.
>
>Your suggestion worked great.
>
>Thanks,
>-Shawn


---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Rob Bowes (rob@wolflair.com) (650) 726-9689
Lone Wolf Development www.wolflair.com



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Message: 16
Date: Tue, 21 Aug 2001 23:03:12 -0700
From: "Shawn Campbell" <shawn@electricstitch.com>
Subject: Re: Restricting options based on unit size

> Just something to keep in the back of your mind while writing data
> files.... :-)
>
> Hope this helps,
> Rob

I can respect that. Thanks.

-Shawn



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