Digest Number 219

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There are 11 messages in this issue.

Topics in this digest:

1. Re: Ravening hordes
From: "Christepher McKenney" <cam1@nrc.gov>
2. Dogs of War
From: mark Roberts <pamark0@yahoo.com>
3. Re: Dogs of War
From: "Christepher McKenney" <cam1@nrc.gov>
4. Is it me or what?
From: ssandford@clearnet.com
5. RE: Is it me or what?
From: Simon Day <sday@dolphin-cs.co.uk>
6. Re: Is it me or what?
From: 'Not Colin' McAlister & The Skrills <demandred@skrill.org>
7. Re: Item & Option Processing Order
From: Rob Bowes <rob@wolflair.com>
8. Re: Item & Option Processing Order
From: Mathias Gehl <mgehl@home.com>
9. Re: Item & Option Processing Order
From: Rob Bowes <rob@wolflair.com>
10. Re: Item & Option Processing Order
From: Mathias Gehl <mgehl@home.com>
11. Re: Item & Option Processing Order
From: Rob Bowes <rob@wolflair.com>


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Message: 1
Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2000 07:51:16 -0500
From: "Christepher McKenney" <cam1@nrc.gov>
Subject: Re: Ravening hordes

Available in the files section of ab-files (egroup newsgroup) or at www.skrill.org .

Christepher

>>> slaneesh@ultim.net 11/17 6:09 PM >>>
Hi I'm already using Army builder but can't find the new files for the ravening hordes and the new codexes. Please say yes!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



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Message: 2
Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2000 06:32:06 -0800 (PST)
From: mark Roberts <pamark0@yahoo.com>
Subject: Dogs of War

Will their be a program for the army to download soon
or is their already. thanks Mark


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Message: 3
Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2000 09:36:17 -0500
From: "Christepher McKenney" <cam1@nrc.gov>
Subject: Re: Dogs of War

The Dogs of War are in the current version (v2.9 - available at www.skrill.org or at www.egroups.com in the AB-files group's directory). The Regiments of Renown will be in soon but probably not til around the end of the week or later.

Christepher


>>> pamark0@yahoo.com 11/20 9:32 AM >>>
Will their be a program for the army to download soon
or is their already. thanks Mark




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Message: 4
Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2000 16:04:36 -0000
From: ssandford@clearnet.com
Subject: Is it me or what?

Hi folks, I'm fairly new to the list. Someone metioned that one
could go to the files section to download AB files. When I look at
the files section all I see is 3 files and no sub directories. I see
the AB FAQ, a zip file and something called berzerk40K. Should I not
be seeing more? Is this cause I'm new and need to be approved to read
more? Help.

Thx

Steven Sandford



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Message: 5
Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2000 15:56:36 -0000
From: Simon Day <sday@dolphin-cs.co.uk>
Subject: RE: Is it me or what?

Hi,

Try this direct link....

http://www.egroups.com/files/ab-files/

Cheers,
Simon Day

> ----------
> From: ssandford@clearnet.com[SMTP:ssandford@clearnet.com]
> Reply To: armybuilder@egroups.com
> Sent: 20 November 2000 16:04
> To: armybuilder@egroups.com
> Subject: [AB] Is it me or what?
>
> Hi folks, I'm fairly new to the list. Someone metioned that one
> could go to the files section to download AB files. When I look at
> the files section all I see is 3 files and no sub directories. I see
> the AB FAQ, a zip file and something called berzerk40K. Should I not
> be seeing more? Is this cause I'm new and need to be approved to read
> more? Help.
>
> Thx
>
> Steven Sandford
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, email
>
> armybuilder-unsubscribe@egroups.com
>
>
> __________________________________________________ ______________________
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Message: 6
Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2000 20:50:18 +0000
From: 'Not Colin' McAlister & The Skrills <demandred@skrill.org>
Subject: Re: Is it me or what?

One fine day in the middle of the night, ssandford@clearnet.com got up
to write:

>Hi folks, I'm fairly new to the list. Someone metioned that one
>could go to the files section to download AB files. When I look at
>the files section all I see is 3 files and no sub directories. I see
>the AB FAQ, a zip file and something called berzerk40K. Should I not
>be seeing more? Is this cause I'm new and need to be approved to read
>more? Help.

The ab-files@egroups.com list holds the datafiles for various game
systems. Its address is: http://www.egroups.com/files/ab-files/

--
'Not Colin' McAlister - License to Skrill
Email: demandred@skrill.org | Visit http://www.skrill.org/ today!
-----------------------------+------------------------------------
"Dovie'andi se tovya sagain" - Robert Jordan's Wheel Of Time


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Message: 7
Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2000 13:38:32 -0800
From: Rob Bowes <rob@wolflair.com>
Subject: Re: Item & Option Processing Order

First, I'm 99.9% certain that there should be no problems posting the data
files for this game. FASA has not given explicit permission for other
games, although they have implied the permission. Given that AB is now an
in-house standard within FASA for all the games it currently supports, I
can't imagine there being any problems. :-) Once you've got the files
ready, let me know and I'll get an official OK from FASA.

Now, onto the problem you're trying to solve with the files.....

There is no way to force the order of items that the user can select as
items. The best solution here is to continue using items, but move all
those items into an item category that is HIDDEN. Then, use options to
select which items are added (via the "take" attribute on the options).
Since the order of options has a controlled order, the corresponding items
also appear in a controlled order. However, by using items this way, you
can use TWEAKS to let the user custom-tailor the individual items. This is
valuable in situations like having two instances of weapon X (e.g. missile
launcher), but one instance uses HE warheads and the other uses army
piercing warheads. In this case, the generic missile launcher is selected
as an option, which then attaches the corresponding item to the vehicle.
The item then displays the various warhead options to the user for selection.

This was the quick-and-dirty description of how it all works. If you have
questions about this, let me know and I'll do my best to answer them.

Hope this helps,
Rob


At 02:42 AM 11/20/00 -0800, you wrote:
>Rob,
> I'm trying to create datafiles for FASA's Renegade Legion Centurion
>game, and am starting with implementing the tank creation rules.
>However, I'm running into a few problems with the order in which
>calculations are performed.
> I'm doing the unit creation by constructing the vehicle out of items
>(although I could re-write it in an option model, if you think that
>might be easier). My problem is that most of the items add to various
>stats, and I occasionally need to perform calculations based on the
>stats, and most importantly, I need to know that the calculations are
>happening before or after certain modifications are made.
> As far as I can figure, for items, everything is processed from
> top to
>bottom of the item list. Is it possible to force this order? Maybe an
>auto-sort, which can sort things by their item category (my set-up
>works, if the items are placed in the right order). Or is there
>something else I can do to get things to happen in a certain order.
>
>Thanks for any help you can give me.
>Mathias Gehl
>mgehl@home.com
>
>P.S. Since the files for VOR are on the website, I presume FASA has
>given permission for datafiles to be published for any of their games,
>right?


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Rob Bowes (rob@wolflair.com) (650) 726-9689
Lone Wolf Development www.wolflair.com


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Message: 8
Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2000 14:31:30 -0800
From: Mathias Gehl <mgehl@home.com>
Subject: Re: Item & Option Processing Order

Thanks. I hadn't thought about the fact that the weapons are nicely
categorized already. Can I allow more than one selection from each
category with zrng? Or do I have to un-hide a new option when the old
one is selected?

Another question - Engine power in this system is purchased in multiples
of 50 (min 50, max 2500). The cost is a simple multiple of the power,
but the mass is looked up on a table. I've done some of the engine
power levels using the ztbl attribute, but I was hoping there was
something more efficient. I originally tried zrng, but needing to look
up the masses for the engines stopped me on that. Actually, is there a
way to create a couple of if-then style attributes? Studying the table,
there are only 3 formulas used to compute the mass, depending on where
in the range of engine powers you are (from 50-450, use this formula.
from 500-1200, use that formula, from 1250-2500, use a third formula).


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Message: 9
Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2000 15:08:12 -0800
From: Rob Bowes <rob@wolflair.com>
Subject: Re: Item & Option Processing Order

At 02:31 PM 11/20/00 -0800, you wrote:
>Thanks. I hadn't thought about the fact that the weapons are nicely
>categorized already. Can I allow more than one selection from each
>category with zrng? Or do I have to un-hide a new option when the old
>one is selected?

Hmmm. I don't understand the question here. Which category? How do
categories pertain to "zrng"? I'm definitely confused on this, so a more
detailed explanation of what you're trying to accomplish would be helpful. :-)

>Another question - Engine power in this system is purchased in multiples
>of 50 (min 50, max 2500). The cost is a simple multiple of the power,
>but the mass is looked up on a table. I've done some of the engine
>power levels using the ztbl attribute, but I was hoping there was
>something more efficient. I originally tried zrng, but needing to look
>up the masses for the engines stopped me on that. Actually, is there a
>way to create a couple of if-then style attributes? Studying the table,
>there are only 3 formulas used to compute the mass, depending on where
>in the range of engine powers you are (from 50-450, use this formula.
>from 500-1200, use that formula, from 1250-2500, use a third formula).

There are no "if/then" structures available, except when used in
conjunction with the "utyp" attribute. I would recommend the following:

1. Have the user select the engine classification (small/medium/large) as
an option.
2. Each of these options uses "more" to display the proper power range as
another optoin.
3. The first 3 options also define a type on the unit, such as "PwrSmall", etc.
4. Later in the priority sequence, you have three more options that apply
the proper formula to the power stat. Each of these uses "utyp:PwrSmall"
and the other two type names you choose. This ensures that only the proper
formula is applied.
5. Use "must" to ensure that the user must pick an engine classification,
and use "dflt" to pick on by default for the user. OR, use a "tabl"
attribute to let them cycle thorugh the 3 available options.

Hope this helps,
Rob

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Rob Bowes (rob@wolflair.com) (650) 726-9689
Lone Wolf Development www.wolflair.com

[This message contained attachments]



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Message: 10
Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2000 16:55:26 -0800
From: Mathias Gehl <mgehl@home.com>
Subject: Re: Item & Option Processing Order



Rob Bowes wrote:
>
> At 02:31 PM 11/20/00 -0800, you wrote:
>
> > Thanks. I hadn't thought about the fact that the weapons are nicely
> > categorized already. Can I allow more than one selection from each
> > category with zrng? Or do I have to un-hide a new option when the
> > old
> > one is selected?
>
> Hmmm. I don't understand the question here. Which category? How do
> categories pertain to "zrng"? I'm definitely confused on this, so a
> more detailed explanation of what you're trying to accomplish would be
> helpful. :-)

Sorry.
By categories I mean the categories the game has created, ex:
Lasers
Mass Drivers

You are allowed a certain number of weapons per tank.
Would it be possible to use zrng to, for example:
select 3 laser weapons and 2 mass driver weapons, and have each of these
5 weapons be displayed as an item (and then I can select the specific
version for each of the items)?


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Message: 11
Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2000 22:48:19 -0800
From: Rob Bowes <rob@wolflair.com>
Subject: Re: Item & Option Processing Order

At 04:55 PM 11/20/00 -0800, you wrote:
> > > Thanks. I hadn't thought about the fact that the weapons are nicely
> > > categorized already. Can I allow more than one selection from each
> > > category with zrng? Or do I have to un-hide a new option when the
> > > old
> > > one is selected?
> >
> > Hmmm. I don't understand the question here. Which category? How do
> > categories pertain to "zrng"? I'm definitely confused on this, so a
> > more detailed explanation of what you're trying to accomplish would be
> > helpful. :-)
>
>Sorry.
>By categories I mean the categories the game has created, ex:
>Lasers
>Mass Drivers
>
>You are allowed a certain number of weapons per tank.
>Would it be possible to use zrng to, for example:
>select 3 laser weapons and 2 mass driver weapons, and have each of these
>5 weapons be displayed as an item (and then I can select the specific
>version for each of the items)?

Hmmm. Neither the "rang" nor "zrng" attributes can be used for complex
things like adding items. They can only be used for simple things like
repeatedly modifying a stat or applying a cost increase. Since I'm still
not 100% certain of how you are envisioning this working, I'll try to
explain more fully and hope that this answers your question. :-)

To start with, each separate item needs to be added via its own "take"
attribute. That means you can't add 3 laser weapons with a single "take".
You COULD use the "take" attribute 3 times on the same option, but that
really doesn't allow for any user adjustment (e.g. the user wants to take 4
laser weapons). :-) You COULD work around this by using a "tabl" attribute
that let the user pick from 0-N instances of a particular weapon category.
Unfortunately, you would need a separate option for each table entry that
attached a different number of instances of that weapon/item. That gets
ugly if you have lots of weapon categories.

There are three ways I can think of in which you can probably tackle this
one. First, the objective. Let's say the user wants to have 5 laser
weapons. He wants two with a normal penetration factor, 2 with a high
penetration factor, and the fifth as a "point-defense" weapon (i.e. to take
out enemy missiles on approach).

Solution #1. Each weapon classification has its own option. That option
uses "take" to attach the corresponding item. It also uses "more" to allow
the user to select a second option for the weapon. Each individual weapon
can then be configured appropriately. If the user wants 3 of the same
thing, he needs to select 3 instances of the weapon and configure each one
the same. This is the crudest and simplest way to implement this.

Solution #2. You start with solution #1. The key difference is that the
user can go into the special items window and modify the count for each
item. This way, only one instance of item X must be configured and the 3
instances of it can be quickly adjusted by the user. The only down-side to
this approach is that the number of items must be modified within the
special items window, which isn't very intuitive (IMHO).

Solution #3. Again you start with solution #1. However, to keep from
forcing the user into the special items window, you attach various "zrng"
tweaks to the item. Each of these tweaks must be mutually exclusive, and
each represents a particular configuration of the weapon. Each tweak
modifies a hidden stat value to represent the proper cost increase of the
item for each instance of the item. Then you use another (lower priority)
tweak with the "zcst:expr=" attribute. This tweak calculates the proper
cost of the item based on the number of instances selected via the "zrng"
tweak.

Going back to the original example, the user would select the first laser
weapon option. This would enable the selection of the second laser weapon
option, which would enable the selection of the third. For the first laser
weapon, the user selects the normal penetation tweak and increases it to 2.
For the second laser weapon, the high penetration tweak is increased to 2.
For the last one, the point-defense tweak is increased to one.

Now that I think about it, you MIGHT be able to set things up where the
user selects the proper number of different configurations all as different
tweaks. This all depends on how complex the cost calculations are. For
example, you could have the user select the "Laser Weapon" option, which
attaches a Laser Weapon item. Then you have three tweaks that each use
"zrng". The first is the number of "Normal Penetration" lasers, the second
is the "High Penetration" lasers, and the third is the "Point Defense"
lasers. The user can adjust all of these values to reflect the number of
each laser weapon wanted on the vehicle.

Whew! I hope this proves helpful. :-)

Thanks, Rob

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Rob Bowes (rob@wolflair.com) (650) 726-9689
Lone Wolf Development www.wolflair.com


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