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daplunk
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Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Adelaide, Australia
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Old September 13th, 2017, 06:03 PM
I suspect people who require offline capability are now the minority in the greater RPG market.
I suspect HLC is stopping LWD from moving forward with technology and customer market share.
I suspect we will see alot of new happy customers around these parts once HLO launches.
I suspect quite a few people who are expressing significant concern now will still try HLO and find it to be useful enough to consider purchasing.

The same way DnDBeyond had pages upon pages of raging complaints about basically the same concerns, they also had significant success upon launch and now have a solid customer base.

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daplunk is online now   #31 Reply With Quote
Toblakai
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Old September 13th, 2017, 07:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by daplunk View Post
I suspect people who require offline capability are now the minority in the greater RPG market.
I suspect HLC is stopping LWD from moving forward with technology and customer market share.
I suspect we will see alot of new happy customers around these parts once HLO launches.
I suspect quite a few people who are expressing significant concern now will still try HLO and find it to be useful enough to consider purchasing.
This!

All the complaints about edge cases, like losing internet. In the last decade the only time my internet went out was when my modem died. Heck, had a severe storm and lost power for a week, still had cable tv and internet, luckily I had a generator.

LWD needs to move forward and unconnected desktop apps are becoming a relic of the past
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Merion
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Old September 13th, 2017, 11:54 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by daplunk View Post
I suspect people who require offline capability are now the minority in the greater RPG market.
I suspect HLC is stopping LWD from moving forward with technology and customer market share.
I suspect we will see alot of new happy customers around these parts once HLO launches.
I suspect quite a few people who are expressing significant concern now will still try HLO and find it to be useful enough to consider purchasing.
Well, true. This is also a very short summary of Rob's long explanary post in the Q&A thread
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daplunk
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Old September 14th, 2017, 12:57 AM
Sometimes a tldr is required

Realm Works - Community Links
Realm Work and Hero Lab Videos
Ream Works Facebook User Group
Realm Works - Community Content List

D&D 5e Community Pack - Contributor
General Hero Lab Support & Community Resources
D&D 5e Community Pack - Install Instructions / D&D 5e Community Pack - Log Fault / D&D 5e Community Pack - Editor Knowledge Base
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EightBitz
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Old September 14th, 2017, 08:40 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by daplunk View Post
I suspect people who require offline capability are now the minority in the greater RPG market.
I suspect HLC is stopping LWD from moving forward with technology and customer market share.
I suspect we will see alot of new happy customers around these parts once HLO launches.
I suspect quite a few people who are expressing significant concern now will still try HLO and find it to be useful enough to consider purchasing.

The same way DnDBeyond had pages upon pages of raging complaints about basically the same concerns, they also had significant success upon launch and now have a solid customer base.
I am definitely in the "significantly concerned, but hope it works well" category. I think every customer should be in the "hope it works well category."

"I don't like this, so I won't even try it, and I want to see it fail out of spite" is just pointless.

Treasure to the Community
(No, really. Motion made, motion carried and motion passed.)

RWExport-To-HTML
Transforms .rwoutput files to HTML or Word.

RedactDescriptions
Redact descriptions from your authored and edited Hero Lab files.

Dresden Files RPG for Hero Lab
On GitHub. I never got around to doing this in a manner where you can add it as a source.
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Paragon
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Old September 14th, 2017, 09:40 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by EightBitz View Post
I am definitely in the "significantly concerned, but hope it works well" category. I think every customer should be in the "hope it works well category."

"I don't like this, so I won't even try it, and I want to see it fail out of spite" is just pointless.
I don't particularly want it to fail, but I don't need to try it to know its a nonstarter for me. The problems I have with it are entirely beyond the Wolves to do anything about and as such are not going to be anything I need to try another online application for me to know its problematic.
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Alewis
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Old September 14th, 2017, 11:00 AM
For myself, everyone that I know, and I can only assume a high percentage of customers, only use HeroLab for character creation. Meaning that the Online features give us nothing but a subscription costs.
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kbs666
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Old September 14th, 2017, 02:27 PM
I am bothered that they seem to intend to use the same data files which means the same scripting language. They have said they intend to improve the UI scripting but my issues with customizing HL were never with the UI and always with the scripting and the way the program handles data. The reason there are so many questions is to a great degree because HL does things in a weird way rather than in a way that makes sense to people used to using other programs with scripting and modding capabilities.

They should be using the opportunity to fix and improve this part of HL so that users and content producers can more easily use the product.

The inability to use the product offline will be a big deal. GenCon still has no WiFi. A lot of people will walk into GenCon next summer with HLO on their devices and suddenly not have access to their characters and havoc will reign.

my Realm Works videos
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCZU...4DwXXkvmBXQ9Yw
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ShadowChemosh
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Old September 14th, 2017, 03:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kbs666 View Post
I am bothered that they seem to intend to use the same data files which means the same scripting language. They have said they intend to improve the UI scripting but my issues with customizing HL were never with the UI and always with the scripting and the way the program handles data. The reason there are so many questions is to a great degree because HL does things in a weird way rather than in a way that makes sense to people used to using other programs with scripting and modding capabilities.

They should be using the opportunity to fix and improve this part of HL so that users and content producers can more easily use the product.
Normally you have pretty smart ideas but this is just crazy talk.

So you want the several millions lines of scripts that are running under HL to be re-written? All the community packs all the files on home PCs and groups and all the 3PP addons and files. Not including all the lines of code that are written right now running all the games HL supports (d20, Pathfinder, 5e, MM, Shadowrun...) Its taken 10+ years for HL to have that code created by thousands of scripters. But you want that changed?

Sorry that is a plan that will sink LW. The scripting language works VERY well at what it does. If you actually spend time learning the language it has very good reasons for working the way it does. Its the VERY reason we all love HL is because of the very powerful language that Rob developed. Everyone here that likes HL needs to understand its because of the scripting language that you enjoy it. Its what drives 95% of what you see and get out of HL. You want to print a character sheet, or prepare a spell, or make something in the editor? Guess what you just touched something that was created with the HL scripting language.

They are correctly going to reuse all those millions lines of code already created as I guarantee that Starfinder started as a fork of Pathfinder. Then they made specific modifications for the UI and to improve some "legacy" ideas and features. But sense it started as a Fork of Pathfinder (as really Starfinder is only a little different from Pathfinder) and uses the HL scripting language means many will be able to jump right in and start coding Starfinder scripts. That is a positive and smart thing for LW to do.

Last point is the guys that are doing work for 3PP are paid on a very tight time schedule. Meaning you change the scripting language , all the time they have to re-learn, is time they will NOT make money. That is a bad thing as some are pretty dependent on the money they make from paid HL work.

Hero Lab Resources:
Pathfinder - d20pfsrd and Pathfinder Pack Setup
3.5 D&D (d20) - Community Server Setup
5E D&D - Community Server Setup
Hero Lab Help - Hero Lab FAQ, Editor Tutorials and Videos, Editor & Scripting Resources.
Created by the community for the community
- Realm Works kickstarter backer (Alpha Wolf) and Beta tester.
- d20 HL package volunteer editor.

Last edited by ShadowChemosh; September 15th, 2017 at 08:51 AM.
ShadowChemosh is offline   #39 Reply With Quote
EightBitz
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Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 1,023

Old September 14th, 2017, 08:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShadowChemosh View Post
Normally you have pretty smart ideas but this is just crazy talk.

So you want the several millions lines of scripts that are running under HL to be re-written? All the community packs all the files on home PCs and groups and all the 3PP addons and files. Not including all the lines of code that are written right now running all the games HL supports (d20, Pathfinder, 5e, MM, Shadowrun...) Its taken 10+ years for HL to have that code created by thousands of scripters. But you want that changed?

Sorry that is a plan that will sink LW. The scripting language works VERY well at what it does. If you actually spend time learning the language it has very good reasons for working the way it does. Its the VERY reason we all love HL is because of the very powerful language that Rob developed. Everyone here that likes HL needs to understand its because of the scripting language that you enjoy it. Its what drives 95% of what you see and get out of HL. You want to print a character sheet, or prepare a spell, or make something in the editor? Guess what you just touched something that was created with the HL scripting language.

They are correctly going to reuse all those millions lines of code already created as I guarantee that Starfinder started as a fork of Pathfinder. Then they made specific modifications for the UI and to improve some "legacy" ideas and features. But sense it started as a Fork of Pathfinder (as really Starfinder is only a little different from Pathfinder) and uses the HL scripting language means many will be able to jump right in and start coding Starfinder scripts. That is a positive and smart thing for LW to do.

Last point is the guys that are doing work for 3PP are paid on a very tight time schedule. Meaning you change the scripting language all the time they have to re-learn is time they will NOT make money. That is a bad thing as some are pretty dependent on the money they make from paid HL work.
One of my favorite movie quotes of all time, because it's so true: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K1Lo-d8AWL0#t=1m52s

Treasure to the Community
(No, really. Motion made, motion carried and motion passed.)

RWExport-To-HTML
Transforms .rwoutput files to HTML or Word.

RedactDescriptions
Redact descriptions from your authored and edited Hero Lab files.

Dresden Files RPG for Hero Lab
On GitHub. I never got around to doing this in a manner where you can add it as a source.
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