Version 5.7 of the d20 System data files is now available!

[qstor]

Thanks for working on the update!

[Dark Lord Galen]

LONG Response Ahead.. :P

Originally Posted by ShadowChemosh

Just thought I would share a few pics of what is coming in the next update. The two big new pieces is Custom Wands which will work like Custom Scrolls allowing you to make a wand of any spell in the game.

FIRST and Most important.. thanks for your efforts Shadow.... and now for the questions....

Originally Posted by ShadowChemosh

On "custom wands", will this be able to be cannibalized for use in other item types, such as if there were items that "stored spells"? ie Rings or rods or staffs, etc?

Attachment 4520

The next one is Deities have finally come to d20! A new editor tab is available to enter your deity with information and layout that matches to Complete Divine. The below shows a few test deities but because of the SRD d20 will only come with the first three listed options (None, Atheist, Other / Philosophy).

I realize the SRD limits what you "Can do", and again any efforts on your part are greatly appreciated.... I for one would make use of this (as discussed in older threads) I was curious if this would bare some of the similarities (in end user interface) as the Herolab 5e piece? Such as being able to separate pantheons of differing cultures? And if it would be possible to restrict those selections within the code? Meaning it would be "unlikely an elf would select from a dwarven pantheon.. so that "group would not be "on the list" so to speak... And lastly, a wish list item from this... would be to be able to create available spell lists based on the domain that the deity oversees..... speaking of domains... is that listed or would be just in a descriptor within the text?

Originally Posted by ShadowChemosh

Attachment 4517

Because of this I have reworked where you select your race and alignment to be on its "own" tab. This allows for a central place to also choose your Deity. Plus your racial abilities will display on the same tab.

Since you have moved the racial and alignment to this tab as well for cohesiveness (good call IMHO) It would seem logical to capture a few other things there as well.
>domains, there for the religious aspects.
> Sub-races, similar again to the pathfinder / 5e setups (see graphic)

Originally Posted by ShadowChemosh

Attachment 4518

The top part of the d20 software now shows your selected race and all classes and levels you have:

Thumbs UP to this!

Originally Posted by ShadowChemosh

Attachment 4519

Just figured I shared so everyone knows we are still moving forward.

Again THANKS ALOT for all your efforts...

Originally Posted by Sendric

Well, that looks especially awesome. Guess I'll have some deities to add.

Me TOO!!! great News can't wait!

Originally Posted by Dami

I have a hefty file of well detailed 3.5 "Living Greyhawk" Deities that I did for Pathfinder. With some tweaks (once I see how its done in the new d20 tab) it should be set to add to community files.

@Dami> Die-hard Greyhawk myself... would love to see this .. happy to help if needed.

Originally Posted by ShadowChemosh

Only its location. It will ONLY display on the Race tab no where else (not on the cleric tab or the Personal tab). I assume you have been comparing "Strings" of the deity text field on the background Pick? All of that is still present on a character.

When you select a deity the Deity Text Box and Alignment chooser will be hidden and the new HasDeity.? tag will be assigned to the hero. In addition the new #hasdeity[] macro can be used to test for a deity.

Will this now be more than just a text type field? so that some code could be leveraged with it? In support of some of the afore mentioned questions above....

Originally Posted by qstor

Thanks for working on the update!

DITTO on this and Again THANKS

[Kendall-DM]

Originally Posted by ShadowChemosh

Only its location. It will ONLY display on the Race tab no where else (not on the cleric tab or the Personal tab). I assume you have been comparing "Strings" of the deity text field on the background Pick? All of that is still present on a character.

When you select a deity the Deity Text Box and Alignment chooser will be hidden and the new HasDeity.? tag will be assigned to the hero. In addition the new #hasdeity[] macro can be used to test for a deity.

No, I've been doing work with tags, those are much more powerful, and string tend to change. I was writing the deity text into the Personal tab, as well as the alignment, but that was about all I was doing text wise. I just used tags to create some decision trees because the Domains work a little differently in my campaign, where each deity forces the choice of one deity specific domain, then a limited choice of a follow up domain that is within that deity's influence.

For example, if there is a deity called Lightbearer, that has a forced choice of a Lightbearer Domain (available only to that deity), andthe choice of one other domain from Law, Good, Sun, and Protection. Hopefully nothing breaks, but if it does, I'll just deal with it, so no worries.

I'm interested in the new tags, could open some doors for how I'm doing things at the moment.

[ShadowChemosh]

Originally Posted by Dark Lord Galen

I realize the SRD limits what you "Can do", and again any efforts on your part are greatly appreciated.... I for one would make use of this (as discussed in older threads) I was curious if this would bare some of the similarities (in end user interface) as the Herolab 5e piece? Such as being able to separate pantheons of differing cultures?

The answer here is no actually. You have to remember 5e was forked from the Pathfinder code that had these advanced UI features in place already. The d20 base code does NOT have these features to build upon yet. Its in the to-do list but I honestly have it marked sort of a low priority. Getting "functional" features into peoples hands I think is more important.

What I would recommend doing is making sure that the new Gods are "Source" marked correctly so that if you are playing in Forgotten Realms and you turn on FR Gods "Source" you only see the FR gods.

Originally Posted by Dark Lord Galen

And if it would be possible to restrict those selections within the code? Meaning it would be "unlikely an elf would select from a dwarven pantheon.. so that "group would not be "on the list" so to speak...

This is possible using the normal HL feature called Pre-Req scripts. For example in the pictures above you can see that the "A New Deity" is grayed out because I put a simple pre-req logic of:

#hasrace[rElf] <> 0

as a Pre-Req so that the god is only valid for Elvin characters. You can add any other "Pre-Req" logic you wish including requiring special feats or ability scores or even only valid for Male characters. Anything you could accomplish with normal HL Pre-Req scripts will work.

Note the Race.? tag is now created automatically for all races based on the races Unique ID. I then push this tag to the Hero allowing easy testing for a race. In addition I have added the new macro of #hasrace[] that allows for a quick way of testing validation for a specific race.

Originally Posted by Dark Lord Galen

And lastly, a wish list item from this... would be to be able to create available spell lists based on the domain that the deity oversees..... speaking of domains... is that listed or would be just in a descriptor within the text?

The gods have a place to list which "domains" they offer (ie by tags). I have not added validation checking automatically to the domain component yet. I would like to get that added before release but "may" not happen. We shall see..

Not sure what you mean by Available Spell Lists based on a Domain? Domains already get specific "Domain" spells. I guess what your asking is for each Deity to support different Domain Spells? If that is what your asking its a Houserule and not part of the SRD. Meaning you won't see me add direct support for this feature. What you could do to accomplish this is setup the domain spells with bootstrap conditions that look at the HasDeity.? tag. Then based on the selected Deity you would get different Domain Spells.

Originally Posted by Dark Lord Galen

Since you have moved the racial and alignment to this tab as well for cohesiveness (good call IMHO) It would seem logical to capture a few other things there as well.
>domains, there for the religious aspects.
> Sub-races, similar again to the pathfinder / 5e setups (see graphic)

To me Domains are class features and should not appear on the Race tab actually. They will continue to appear on the Class tab where you select them from.

Stuff like Sub-races, Creature Types, Sub-Types, alternate racial abilities and etc etc are "eventually" going to go to this new "Race" tab. Its the main reason it was worth taking the time to move the Deity, Alignments and Race choosers now. But those other changes are still coming in "future" updates. Not currently.

[ShadowChemosh]

Originally Posted by Kendall-DM

For example, if there is a deity called Lightbearer, that has a forced choice of a Lightbearer Domain (available only to that deity), and the choice of one other domain from Law, Good, Sun, and Protection. Hopefully nothing breaks, but if it does, I'll just deal with it, so no worries.

This should work just fine in the new system. On the Deity you would setup access to the Lightbearer, Law, Good, Sun and Protection domain.

Then what I would do is setup a Pre-Eval rule that only fires when the Deity selected becomes a Pick (do this by checking the @pick variable). You would also maybe want to say you are valid if not a Cleric or other "Domain" choosing class. Then make the deity valid if it can specifically find the Lightbearer domain on the character. This way your players would get a nice message after selecting the god to add the Lightbearer domain. Once lightbearer was added the error message goes away.

That I think would be the easy way.

Originally Posted by Kendall-DM

I'm interested in the new tags, could open some doors for how I'm doing things at the moment.

hope so.

[Dark Lord Galen]

Originally Posted by ShadowChemosh

The answer here is no actually. You have to remember 5e was forked from the Pathfinder code that had these advanced UI features in place already. The d20 base code does NOT have these features to build upon yet. Its in the to-do list but I honestly have it marked sort of a low priority. Getting "functional" features into peoples hands I think is more important.

That's cool. I was not sure at what stage of transition you were at... and getting some functionality is miles ahead of the "oldway"...

Originally Posted by ShadowChemosh

What I would recommend doing is making sure that the new Gods are "Source" marked correctly so that if you are playing in Forgotten Realms and you turn on FR Gods "Source" you only see the FR gods.

That works...

Originally Posted by ShadowChemosh

The gods have a place to list which "domains" they offer (ie by tags). I have not added validation checking automatically to the domain component yet. I would like to get that added before release but "may" not happen. We shall see..

That works...

Originally Posted by ShadowChemosh

Not sure what you mean by Available Spell Lists based on a Domain? Domains already get specific "Domain" spells. I guess what your asking is for each Deity to support different Domain Spells? DLG>YES
If that is what your asking its a Houserule and not part of the SRD. DLG>YES, but only in some cases. There were additional domains added after the SRD and there are also domains that are campaign specific (Greyhawk in this case)
Meaning you won't see me add direct support for this feature. What you could do to accomplish this is setup the domain spells with bootstrap conditions that look at the HasDeity.? tag. Then based on the selected Deity you would get different Domain Spells.

Your workaround will do.. there are not many.... Domains, but some spells are "homebrew" and Deity specific.

IF I understand your response to Kendall-DM I think that partly answers this?

Originally Posted by ShadowChemosh

To me Domains are class features and should not appear on the Race tab actually. They will continue to appear on the Class tab where you select them from.

I agree, and to clarify a couple points, I was referring to a list of domains that, through the editor, could be bootlegged to that deity. And when the Player is perusing the Deities list, that those domains would show with that deity... for now a text box works for domains "ruled over"...and toggling back to the class to set the domain spell choice for the class.

Originally Posted by ShadowChemosh

Stuff like Sub-races, Creature Types, Sub-Types, alternate racial abilities and etc etc are "eventually" going to go to this new "Race" tab. Its the main reason it was worth taking the time to move the Deity, Alignments and Race choosers now. But those other changes are still coming in "future" updates. Not currently.

Agreed, and in the interim I have already created "sub-races" with their abilities...
Would there be a preferred methodology to anticipate supporting the newer format to come? or will, when those features come to fruition, have to be rebuilt? I am presuming the latter?


Thanks for your response, efforts and clarity of detail.. if my novice mundane ability can serve .. I am happy to help....

[Kendall-DM]

Originally Posted by ShadowChemosh

This should work just fine in the new system. On the Deity you would setup access to the Lightbearer, Law, Good, Sun and Protection domain.

Then what I would do is setup a Pre-Eval rule that only fires when the Deity selected becomes a Pick (do this by checking the @pick variable). You would also maybe want to say you are valid if not a Cleric or other "Domain" choosing class. Then make the deity valid if it can specifically find the Lightbearer domain on the character. This way your players would get a nice message after selecting the god to add the Lightbearer domain. Once lightbearer was added the error message goes away.

Pretty much what I'm doing, have a pre-eval rule for clerics that only highlights the deity specific domains to be chosen from, then once one of those is chosen, it only highlights the additional domains that are available for the deity. It's been working pretty well for the last couple of years, and your evaluation of it is pretty spot on.

[ShadowChemosh]

Originally Posted by Dark Lord Galen

Not sure what you mean by Available Spell Lists based on a Domain? Domains already get specific "Domain" spells. I guess what your asking is for each Deity to support different Domain Spells? DLG>YES
If that is what your asking its a Houserule and not part of the SRD. DLG>YES, but only in some cases. There were additional domains added after the SRD and there are also domains that are campaign specific (Greyhawk in this case)

If there is a 3.5 book that needs to support this feature please point me to it. Its easier for me to add features if I can show that a specific "book" needs it.

Originally Posted by Dark Lord Galen

Your workaround will do.. there are not many.... Domains, but some spells are "homebrew" and Deity specific.

IF I understand your response to Kendall-DM I think that partly answers this?

I think its a little different. Kendall-DM was in need of forcing a gamer to select a specific domain for a specific god. If I get time I will create an example Domain that has different spells per deity.

Originally Posted by Dark Lord Galen

And when the Player is perusing the Deities list, that those domains would show with that deity... for now a text box works for domains "ruled over"...and toggling back to the class to set the domain spell choice for the class.

Oh I get yeah. That is a good point. I wrote the display script logic many weeks ago so I don't remember if it shows the domains. But that is a good idea and I will make sure to add that feature if not already done before release. Let me make a note so I don't forget...

Originally Posted by Dark Lord Galen

Agreed, and in the interim I have already created "sub-races" with their abilities... Would there be a preferred methodology to anticipate supporting the newer format to come? or will, when those features come to fruition, have to be rebuilt? I am presuming the latter?

The best method going forward is to make these a new component. Meaning they will get there own special Tab in the editor for setup. It makes it SO much easier to keep the logic separate then trying to make use of the generic "Special" that is in the system. The fact that Special can be on a race or a class is really making some changes very difficult.

Assuming you made your sub-races as "Specials" it is possible to go into the XML of the user file and change the component set field to the new one I will create. This would cause your specials to display in the new "Sub-Race" editor tab. Obviously you have to be comfortable working with XML.

[ShadowChemosh]

Originally Posted by ShadowChemosh

This is possible using the normal HL feature called Pre-Req scripts. For example in the pictures above you can see that the "A New Deity" is grayed out because I put a simple pre-req logic of:

#hasrace[rElf] <> 0

as a Pre-Req so that the god is only valid for Elvin characters. You can add any other "Pre-Req" logic you wish including requiring special feats or ability scores or even only valid for Male characters. Anything you could accomplish with normal HL Pre-Req scripts will work.

I have made this part easier as its now a selection on the Deity editor tab. You can simply select the race or races that the deity is restricted too.

Please note for some races (ie Elf) you should pick the Race.Elf tag and not the "Race.rElf" tag. Elf is the general tag that is on all Elf races (Elf; Elf Varisian; Aquatic Elf). Where if you used "Race.rElf" tag you are saying only the specific race "Elf" would be valid.

Originally Posted by ShadowChemosh

The gods have a place to list which "domains" they offer (ie by tags). I have not added validation checking automatically to the domain component yet. I would like to get that added before release but "may" not happen. We shall see..

Domain validation based on your chosen deity is finished. Yeah! Though this got me looking at the Domains that are included and saw that many are lacking information, features, and a good domain spell mechanics.

Originally Posted by ShadowChemosh

Not sure what you mean by Available Spell Lists based on a Domain? Domains already get specific "Domain" spells. I guess what your asking is for each Deity to support different Domain Spells?

What you could do to accomplish this is setup the domain spells with bootstrap conditions that look at the HasDeity.? tag. Then based on the selected Deity you would get different Domain Spells.

So I misspoke about how domain spells work as its VERY different than Pathfinder. I will be re-working the way you associate a Spell to a Domain. This will make it much easier to setup new domains and will allow for an easy method to define different spells per deity (I hope).

[ShadowChemosh]

Originally Posted by ShadowChemosh

So I misspoke about how domain spells work as its VERY different than Pathfinder. I will be re-working the way you associate a Spell to a Domain. This will make it much easier to setup new domains and will allow for an easy method to define different spells per deity (I hope).

This is done. What this looks like now is you have a "Domain Spells" button and you just select the spells you want to be allowed for your domain. This moves the control from the Spell to the Domain making setup of new domains much easier.

Here is the Domain editor tab now:
Editor Tab Domain.jpg

For those that want to change out a domains spells based on the deity here are some script examples. These are to be setup on the "Deity" itself and set to run "BEFORE" Pre-Levels/10000.

This example script has two examples. The first changes a single spell for the war domain. The second totally replaces all the spell choices of the Air domain:

    <eval phase="PreLevel" priority="5000"><![CDATA[
      ~ Set focus to the war domain if present on hero
      perform hero.findchild[BaseClrDom,"AllowDom.cdWar"].setfocus
  
      ~ Change out the War Domain's 3rd level spell with Prayer
      if (state.isfocus <> 0) then
        perform focus.delete[ClsScAllSp.sClr30019]
        perform focus.assign[ClsScAllSp.sClr30022]
      endif
      
      perform state.clearfocus
      
      ~ Set focus to the Air domain if present on hero
      perform hero.findchild[BaseClrDom,"AllowDom.cdAir"].setfocus
  
      ~ Change out all the Air Domain's spells
      if (state.isfocus <> 0) then
        perform focus.delete[ClsScAllSp.?]
        perform focus.assign[ClsScAllSp.sDWat10000]
        perform focus.assign[ClsScAllSp.sDWat20000]
        perform focus.assign[ClsScAllSp.sDWat30000]
        perform focus.assign[ClsScAllSp.spConWat4]
        perform focus.assign[ClsScAllSp.sDWat50000]
        perform focus.assign[ClsScAllSp.spCoCold6]
        perform focus.assign[ClsScAllSp.spAcidFog7]
        perform focus.assign[ClsScAllSp.sDWat80000]
        perform focus.assign[ClsScAllSp.sDWat90000]
      endif
      ]]><before name="Domain Secondary Spells"/>
      </eval>