Tablet Wars II: Attack of Android 3.0

[drakahn99]

i don't see a reason to choose either android or ios, another approach would be to add in a web based server that you can use remotely from a web browser via proxy from the server. so when i go to herlab/mypc it would redirect me to my personal computer and pull the web interface for the program.

going this route would also make it easier to add in suport for future devices if something better comes down the road that isnt ios/android or windows devices, as long as it has a browser built in it can access my herloab.

as an added bonus it would also store characters locally. and if i were playing a web based game through a virtual table top. we could have direct links to characters something like this (http:/herolab.com/mycomputer/mycharacter)

since this is ran by proxy the herolab web servers would not deal with much added bandwith, if that is an issue there is also dynamic ip programs that can be used that would negate the need to use a proxy through the herolab website.

just a suggestion.

[rob]

Originally Posted by drakahn99

i don't see a reason to choose either android or ios, another approach would be to add in a web based server that you can use remotely from a web browser via proxy from the server.

There's one major flaw in this approach. It requires that every user always have internet access from the tablet in order to use the product. A lot of people who buy tablets don't pay for 4G service, since that would dramatically increase their costs. We want the tablet version to be usable *everywhere*, such as at local cons, game stores, etc. You don't get everywhere access if you require an internet connection.

[Jamz]

Wait? There's places without internet? NOOO!

But in reality, that could be solved with cache options just like Google Docs and such. Depending on how much "work" was done client side vs server side.

But I have mixed feelings about html5 apps vs native apps. There are trade offs for sure.

[rob]

Originally Posted by Jamz

But in reality, that could be solved with cache options just like Google Docs and such. Depending on how much "work" was done client side vs server side.

If we re-wrote the entire product from the ground up in a completely different programming language, including all the complexity of the back-end, *then* the work could be done on the client without an internet connection. But then we're talking about a release date in 2014 or 2015. So that's not a viable option. :P

Sure, everything can be solved with enough work. It's a question of cost - time, money, and opportunity.

However, your statement above makes it sound like we just aren't trying hard enough on this end by simply waving your hand and saying it could be solved. While *you* may understand the implications of what you're saying, the vast majority of our users - and readers of this thread - do *not* understand those implications. So your hand-wave is incredibly misleading to others.

Please be careful with what you say, since it can easily be interpreted incorrectly by those that simply take it at face value.

[Jamz]

Rob, sorry, don't want to confuse anyone as I understand that indeed would be a major undertaking. In my simplistic view I keep confusing what I want "now" vs what you guys are trying to offer.

Right now, I'd be happy with a HeroLab Portvolio "Viewer" to show my character and run him during game with possibly a few "condition" modifier check boxes vs what you guys are working towards being HeroLabs running on a tablet.

On another front, I'm assuming HeroLab will run on Windows 8 (looking at the new Ultra hybrids), and probably will not run on Win 8 RT? Other than RT being an ARM processor, I have no idea what would be involved porting to RT. Is that on your road map?

[rob]

Originally Posted by Jamz

Right now, I'd be happy with a HeroLab Portvolio "Viewer" to show my character and run him during game with possibly a few "condition" modifier check boxes vs what you guys are working towards being HeroLabs running on a tablet.

To properly support any condition modifiers at all, then entire engine is needed. The Mac port got us 80% of the way on that for the iPad.

Our initial tablet release will be a "smart viewer" along the lines you're asking for. We need to first get a framework in place to build the tablet application on top of, which is nearly complete. Then we can get all the initial functionality into place to provide a "smart viewer". After that, we can continue to flesh out the functionality to achieve the full Hero Lab product.

Originally Posted by Jamz

On another front, I'm assuming HeroLab will run on Windows 8 (looking at the new Ultra hybrids), and probably will not run on Win 8 RT? Other than RT being an ARM processor, I have no idea what would be involved porting to RT. Is that on your road map?

Yes, Hero Lab runs great on Windows 8. However, it will *not* work on the RT. Going from Windows to RT is like going from OSX to iOS - it's a complete departure.

Support for RT depends entirely on how it does in the marketplace. After we get the iPad version into place, we'll then assess whether to support Android or RT next, based on both the market and the ease of implementation.

[Rethlyr]

As far as Windows 8 tablets, while HeroLab will not run on RT tablets, there are now tablets coming that run Windows 8 on a traditional intel processor on the tablet, which should mean the any desktop software should run on those tablets (barring obvious hardware demands - i.e. Crysis 2).

[Pfhoenix]

If Hero Lab was written for .Net, you could look into Mono for quick porting to iOS and Android. Xamarin is pricey, but the time saved is tremendous.

[MagicSN]

Hello!

I have to admit I do not understand this "we need to decide for one of them". The answer is "platform independent programming". I have been working for a company who was doing game conversions from Windows to "X" (where "X" was AmigaOS 4, AmigaOS Classic, Linux and MacOS). It was always quite easy if you went for developing some core libraries first (in this case a GUI Library, probably - might even go about just porting some existing OpenSource GUI Toolkit and then progressing from there). Some of my friends at my former company (if Hyperion Entertainment rings a bell to anyone?) even implemented complex things like Firefox (completely with UI Toolkit below it) to new platforms.

Of course if you do everything with the "native" UI then indeed you have to "choose one". But if you decide to plan the project from start in a platform independent way (first make some library toolkits for the os dependent stuff, then the actual application) you get a product for several OSes at once -> more money.

And it is not that I just set up claims. I have been working in this sort of business for several years myselves.

MagicSN

[rob]

Originally Posted by MagicSN

I have to admit I do not understand this "we need to decide for one of them". The answer is "platform independent programming".

Please read our official announcement regarding tablets. That's the first approach we researched. However, there were some major problems with battery life and the tools available. The good tools are designed for games and suck the battery quickly. We needed something that would "play nice" with the battery. We also needed a tool that would allow us to port across the entire Hero Lab engine without having to rewrite it, and that precluded some tools from being viable. There were other factors as well that all contributed to making an off-the-shelf, platform-independent toolset unworkable. So we were forced to "decide for one of them".

This was all covered in the official announcement, so I ask that you please read it before implying that we're incompetent. We did our homework on this. A platform independent solution would have been the ideal solution, but we couldn't find a viable way of doing that with the tools available at the time we got started.