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Pheonix33
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Join Date: Feb 2019
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Old February 9th, 2019, 02:01 AM
Q: How will my Hero Lab Classic secondary licenses transfer to Hero Lab Online?
A: In Hero Lab Classic, secondary licenses allow users to access their content on multiple devices. Hero Lab Online will employ a similar concept, allowing simultaneous access to your account from multiple devices (e.g. multiple family members). Migration from Classic to Online will convert your secondary licenses to simultaneous devices in the new environment.

I bought Hero lab online PF2E edition today specifically for this reason, and it hasn't been implemented and there is no talk of it anywhere. (Except for a forum post from October asking the same thing.)

For hero lab classic we have 4 extra licenses and with the conversion to HLO they become useless so, do we have an eta at least?

(I'm sorry, I'm frustrated, and if i missed a box or something to activate the ability to use it on multiple computers i will eat a shoe.)
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Rone
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Old February 11th, 2019, 03:14 PM
Welcome to the boards, Pheonix33!

You can use Hero Lab Online on as many devices as you like so long as you're only logged onto one at a time.

Now, multiple licenses... those were only ever meant to provide use on a variety of devices for the account owner. But that said, we are working on a group license feature that we hope to unveil this summer.
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Pheonix33
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Old February 11th, 2019, 06:36 PM
Thank you, I do like to know a timeline of when that would be implemented, and i understand how classic was originally meant to work, it was more this sentence that made it seem like it was already in use.

" Hero Lab Online will employ a similar concept, allowing simultaneous access to your account from multiple devices (e.g. multiple family members). Migration from Classic to Online will convert your secondary licenses to simultaneous devices in the new environment."

I bought 2 licenses for hero lab online so myself and my sister could use it, because i love your program. It was just disappointing, the wording made it seem like it was something we could already do with the program. So you may want to check your F.A.Q to make sure its accurate.
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Rone
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Old February 12th, 2019, 01:53 PM
Thank you for your input! We'll alter the wording on the site to be less confusing.
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jlong05
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Old February 15th, 2019, 05:12 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rone View Post
Thank you for your input! We'll alter the wording on the site to be less confusing.
Wait, so the promised functionality from the start of this, you are saying, was incorrect and never intended?

This severly undermines the functionality of the tool and is significantly divergent from how Classic is managed and maintained.

Rone, apologies, but I know you were not here from the start, but many of us have been. I think you may want to double back on this item and confirm what you have stated is actually the correct stance now. That may have more of a public impact than 1 or 2 users. I am pretty sure a vast number of Classic users used the tool as the OP stated for campaigns where the DM/GM owned all the licenses and used them at game time with their family and friends. Hence that verbiage as it was originally.

The only "hobby" GW is interested in is lining their pockets with your money.
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CorzatTheGray
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Old February 15th, 2019, 06:14 AM
As I read this... something I noticed...

Hero Lab Online Pathfinder 2.0 Playtest license is not the same as Hero Lab Classic multiple license Migration.
Also to my knowledge, no migration of Classic has occurred as of yet so the implementation of the multiple license being used for multiple concurrent device login hasn't happened.
If I've missed something in my understanding of how this process was to take place... then I'll say that I was/am just as confused as anyone.

Currently Playing: Pathfinder - Skull & Shackles AP
Current Character: Legendary Gunslinger 11
Currently DMing: D&D 5E - AAW Games A-Series
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BJ
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Old February 15th, 2019, 02:41 PM
Let me see if I can clear up any confusion.

As many of you are already aware, a great many Hero Lab Users were violating our Terms of Service by lending out there licenses to people outside of their households/states/countries. Our licenses were always meant to be one account per user. Multiple licenses were intended to allow you to log in to your account via multiple devices since our license numbers at that time were each tied to one specific device and there was no ability to log out of one and into another. This caused frustration for those who owned a computer and an iPad or some other combination of devices they wanted to build characters with and led to the birth of multiple licenses.

Our tech skills have come a long way since the original introduction of Hero Lab more than a decade ago and we put them to use to eliminate the confusing process of people frequently needing to reauthorize their licenses for new devices and other hiccups that naturally occur in day to day device use. Our Hero Lab Classic support staff spends a good part of each day sorting out these issues with license reassignments for the many consumers who don't fully understand the system and have locked themselves out of it. The new system streamlines the process and allows you to use your account on any device you like so long as you are logged in to only one place at a time and thus solves the issue of needing multiple licenses and aid from tech support every time you want to use a new device.

For those of you who want to use the same account simultaneously with a group of individuals (such as family members or your game group), we are working on a way to provide a group license that meets the approval of our partners so groups can share in character creation and play via one master account.

For those of you who just want to share character creation and printing, you can do that now from any device, so long as only one person is using the account at a time and you're comfortable allowing them access to your login information.

Hero Lab Online is a different creature than Hero Lab Classic, so titles of features change as we evolve into a better system. Ultimately, I believe what you are looking for is the group license and we are shooting for late spring early summer for the launch of both group licenses and online player-GM interaction.

I hope that helps!

Last edited by BJ; February 15th, 2019 at 02:44 PM.
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Toblakai
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Old February 15th, 2019, 04:45 PM
I look forward to Pathfinder migration and to the HLO GM tools! The licensing makes a lot of sense and will allow you to get paid for your hard work instead of being cheated by people who share licenses with friends.
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WatersLethe
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Old February 22nd, 2019, 08:13 AM
No offense to Lone Wolf, but the license approach to Hero Lab has always been embarrassingly out of touch. I'm going to take a moment to explain why the old model was poor for several reasons and establish why I think a group license is a good idea, and what it needs to entail to be successful.

First, I firmly believe the folks at Lone Wolf should be getting well-paid for their efforts. Both Hero Lab Classic and Hero Lab Online are fantastic products, and the speed of updates and dedication to quality are apparent.

My Hero Lab Classic License Experience:

I brought myself and my group into Pathfinder cold. We hadn’t played much D&D in years, leaving off with 4th edition, so we didn’t have a go-to character generator method. We were the ideal new target customers. For a few years when I didn’t have money I used PCGen, but found its update cycle unsatisfying and its user experience lacking. I took up Hero Lab because they partnered with Paizo for quick updates and were known for generating rules adherent characters. As the GM, I quickly found the product neigh indispensable.

My players, on the other hand, were faced with an entirely different set of priorities. From their perspective, they could generate characters by hand for free if PCGen didn’t have all their desired options. In the worst case, they could ask me to check their character for them. The notion that they each would buy their own Hero Lab licenses to make their characters was absurd, given the sheer cost to do so. After all, they only had to make one character a year or thereabouts.

What this came down to was me sitting down with each player to generate their characters with my Hero Lab license so that I wouldn’t have to recreate them to check that they’d done it correctly by hand or with other software. This morphed into me helping them level because the characters were already in the software and it was easy enough to do.

Where was the incentive for them to shell out cash for the product? I was already happy with my purchase, so I wasn’t going to ask them to chip in because I don’t want anyone to claim partial ownership of my licenses. They could use my license through me for free, and if they couldn’t they would make characters by hand and end up in the same place anyway. When someone else wanted to start GMing, the cost to dive into Hero Lab for them was astronomical, all to get the same functionality that was sitting unused in my license because I was a player.

As the designated Hero Lab jockey for my group, I shelled out the money for extra licenses so that I could have Hero Lab on my multiple computers (two PCs, Laptop and Surface) so that my players could read their options as I went around helping out. Did that break the terms? It’s hard to say, since I was actively and personally engaged in all instances of Hero Lab running at once. I had to be involved, because as the Hero Lab jockey I was the only one engaged and knowledgeable enough about the software to move the character generation phase smoothly forward. I also don’t mind being involved in this because making characters is fun and I like helping out.

At any point I would have paid a reasonable fee to let them use Hero Lab on their own, to get them more familiar with the software, and let them explore options at home, but that option did not exist and as such they remain uninvested mentally or financially in Hero Lab and now Hero Lab Online.

Why A Group License is a Good Thing and What It Needs

A licensing model where one person who is invested, typically the GM, can buy all the content packs and share that functionality within their group would have significant potential to increase the engagement and value of groups like mine.

Why It’s Good:

Upfront Value to Lone Wolf: A group option could be as simple as temporary loaner licenses that the main Hero Lab license holder can buy and hand out. I would pay ~$1-5 per license per month for this functionality, based on my own rough cost-benefit analysis. For my group, this is money that is not, and will never be, in Lone Wolf’s pocket without such an option.

Added Consumer Value to Hero Lab: Hero Lab is useful as is. Being able to share it with the group, and potentially use it at the table, increases the value of the software beyond character gen for my group. That value is not enough on its own to incentivize my players to buy full HLO copies.

Additional Player Engagement: With more players in my group being able to play around with the software on their own and familiarize themselves with it, more players will develop Hero Lab “brand loyalty”.

Full Utilization of Future Features: With the current model, adding group play features and interaction, or ship management is of limited value because it’s still not providing enough utility to get my group to sink money into a full HLO license with all the books. If there is a group option, it can let those features shine.

Accounting for Various User Economic Statuses: Not everyone has the same financial situation. To one person, it’s no problem to buy all the newest books, to another that would mean not eating for a few days. If one person with the money to buy the full licenses can also share them at their own expense without having to buy a whole new set of full licenses for their friends, they’re likely to do so. This helps get low budget players into the HLO ecosystem and keep them there, and be accepting of new content instead of sticking with the cheaper options like “core only”.

What It Needs:

A group licensing scheme shouldn’t be one shared license with a higher base cost, because that disincentivizes people from buying their own personal licenses, and makes it very awkward when groups split up. If the shareable aspect is a purchasable add-on to a regular license, this model could potentially work, but pricing will be a delicate task and runs into the next point.

A group licensing scheme needs to allow individual accounts, not simply more logins to one account. Being able to personally secure your characters and info is important, and many people would be hesitant about handing out login info for one account, especially to new group members.

It must allow license revocation, to avoid unauthorized access to the group’s content from prior members of the group.

Thank you for listening to my TEDtalk

Last edited by WatersLethe; March 15th, 2019 at 07:50 AM.
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Dami
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Old February 22nd, 2019, 03:26 PM
I agree with WatersLethe - good ideas.
My gaming group has two of us who take turns running games, and each of us own a heap of actual rulebooks. The other five guys in the group have about three books between them. I use HL on my PC at home for most things, and take a laptop to some sessions with my secondary license.
Two of the players have shown interest in HL. I nearly bought a license for one as a gift because I knew he'd get a lot out of it, but he would then have to pay to add a heap of extra packages on just to recreate his own character.
As a gaming group, we shouldn't all have to buy actual book copies to play the game, and I don't see why we should have to do that with a computer program either. I'd really like a group license available- for CLASSIC not just for HLO, and SOON! Thanks.

Current RPG's: Pathfinder (GM), Pathfinder (Player), Gamma World (GM, Pathfinder homebrew).
HeroLab: 3.5 & Pathfinder. HL User Files for PF: Greyhawk Setting, Gamma World (WIP).

DM and player of D&D since 1980.
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