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Bloodwolf
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Old November 7th, 2020, 12:09 AM
During this I found an error in the Green and Red Dragons. The spell that is tied to the Suggestion Spell-Like Ability is the level 2 Bard spell (spSuggest2) when it should be the level 3 Sor/Wiz spell (spSuggest3). The DC shown on the Spells tab is correct (10+3(Spell Level)+Cha Bonus) but the spell list is a level 2. Which would be a DC (10+2(Spell Level)+Cha Bonus) if anyone notices. I'll create a correct version to be added when I add the rest of the entries.

Edit -
Ok I found a couple more like this and will include them as well. I think that you will like how things turned out. I'm going to add a snip of how the black dragon turned out.




Last edited by Bloodwolf; November 7th, 2020 at 01:21 AM.
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Bloodwolf
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Old November 7th, 2020, 11:52 AM
Sendric. I have a dilemma.

I want the DC to show in the name for Spell-Like Abilities like in my snips and I want to make the sla entries as multi useful as possible. The problem is many Spell-Like Abilities have multiple Spell Levels. One monster could use a Cleric version and another could use the Sor/Wiz version that is a different level. Multi useful with determining the Spell Level later requires a lot of custom scripting in the next entry that they are bootstrapped to each and every time. This causes the problem of extra work every time.

So the options are as follows:

1. Create one super generic entry for a Spell-Like Ability like Suggestion and then use scripts in the entry Spell-Like Abilities: [Insert monster name] to put the DC in the live name. The problem with this is you have to tie the Suggestion spell description in the generic entry and it shows the Spell Level for the description that you tie it to. And that could be different from the one that the monster uses. For example; if you tie to the Cleric version of the spell it will show a Spell Level of 2 but if the monster uses the Sor/Wiz spell list it is a Spell Level of 3, and vice versa. I would prefer not to use this method for that very reason.

2. Create a sort of generic entry for a Spell-Like Ability like Suggestion and make it Spell Level specific at that time. The advantage is the script for the DC will be right in the entry and anytime you bootstrap it the DC will automatically pull over without extra work every time. The disadvantage is that you will have to create multiple entries for each Spell-Like Ability, one for each Spell Level listed. I prefer this method because the spell description that is tied to each entry can be the correct Spell Level. I figure the easiest way to label these would be slaSuggestSL2 and slaSuggestSL3 for examples.

My question is which would you like me to do?

Last edited by Bloodwolf; November 7th, 2020 at 11:54 AM.
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Bloodwolf
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Old November 8th, 2020, 01:26 PM
Is there anyway to tell what all entries something is bootstrapped to?

For example, is there any way to tell everything slaWallFir is bootstrapped to?
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Bloodwolf
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Old November 8th, 2020, 02:09 PM
On options 2 of my earlier post I think that a better way to label each this is as follows, using the same examples:

Instead of slaSuggestSL2. I thinks slaSuggestSL2Cha is better for using with these entries.
Breaking it down as follows:
sla - Spell-Like Abililties - Same for all Spell-Like Abilities.
Suggest - Suggestion - Spell name or abbreviation.
SL - Spell Level.
2 - The actual Spell Level.
Cha - Charisma - The ability bonus that this entry uses to determine the DC for the Saving Throw. If no Saving Throw is needed for this spell there will be nothing after the Spell Level.

Instead of slaSuggestSL3. I thinks slaSuggestSL3Cha is better for using with these entries.
Breaking it down as follows:
sla - Spell-Like Abililties - Same for all Spell-Like Abilities.
Suggest - Suggestion - Spell name or abbreviation.
SL - Spell Level.
3 - The actual Spell Level.
Cha - Charisma - The ability bonus that this entry uses to determine the DC for the Saving Throw. If no Saving Throw is needed for this spell there will be nothing after the Spell Level.

Almost all spells have different Spell Levels based on which class spell list is being used. This style labeling shows right away which level the entry uses to determine the DC. And different classes tend to use different ability bonuses to determine the DC. This style labeling shows right away which ability, if any, the entry uses to determine the DC.
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Sendric
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Old November 9th, 2020, 05:23 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bloodwolf View Post
There is one last thing that I would love to be able to do that I think that I'm figuring out. Maybe let me know what you think first.

I plan to add the DC to the live name in the Spell-Like Abilities on the Spells tab. Example from a Black Dragon:

Corrupt Water has a DC equal to the Frightful Presence DC. Currently I have it showing as "Corrupt Water (1/day) (Sp)". But I managed it get it to show as "Corrupt Water (DCXX) (1/day) (Sp)". With the Frightful Presence DC as it changes per age category showing.

I managed to do very close to the same thing with the radius of Darkness but using the DC is a bit more complex. But I have it so far. At this point I think that I have it done for the Black Dragon I'm going to work on the rest now.
The Spell-Like Abilities things I set up in Custom - Spell Like Abilities already have scripts in place to provide DC in the name. Users need only be sure they set the correct spell level when they are using them. (See the eval scripts on them - note only those spells that require a DC will have these scripts).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bloodwolf View Post
My question is which would you like me to do?
Looking at the Suggestion thing in the Spell-Like Abilities file, its default spell level is 3. When bootstrapping it to a creature who uses it at a different spell level, users can set the field [Value2] to a different number to over-ride the default. The only thing not taken into account here is if the creature uses a different ability score than CHA to determine the DC. That can be fixed if need be using a similar technigue.

Last edited by Sendric; November 9th, 2020 at 05:27 AM.
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Sendric
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Old November 9th, 2020, 05:28 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bloodwolf View Post
Is there anyway to tell what all entries something is bootstrapped to?

For example, is there any way to tell everything slaWallFir is bootstrapped to?
I use Windows Grep to search through the data files for mentions of the thing I'm searching for This will show the line of text where it appears in every file. It should show if it is bootstrapped to something. I don't know of any simpler way.
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Sendric
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Old November 9th, 2020, 05:31 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bloodwolf View Post
On options 2 of my earlier post I think that a better way to label each this is as follows, using the same examples:

Instead of slaSuggestSL2. I thinks slaSuggestSL2Cha is better for using with these entries.
Breaking it down as follows:
sla - Spell-Like Abililties - Same for all Spell-Like Abilities.
Suggest - Suggestion - Spell name or abbreviation.
SL - Spell Level.
2 - The actual Spell Level.
Cha - Charisma - The ability bonus that this entry uses to determine the DC for the Saving Throw. If no Saving Throw is needed for this spell there will be nothing after the Spell Level.

Instead of slaSuggestSL3. I thinks slaSuggestSL3Cha is better for using with these entries.
Breaking it down as follows:
sla - Spell-Like Abililties - Same for all Spell-Like Abilities.
Suggest - Suggestion - Spell name or abbreviation.
SL - Spell Level.
3 - The actual Spell Level.
Cha - Charisma - The ability bonus that this entry uses to determine the DC for the Saving Throw. If no Saving Throw is needed for this spell there will be nothing after the Spell Level.

Almost all spells have different Spell Levels based on which class spell list is being used. This style labeling shows right away which level the entry uses to determine the DC. And different classes tend to use different ability bonuses to determine the DC. This style labeling shows right away which ability, if any, the entry uses to determine the DC.
As stated above, there's already a mechanism in place to handle the spell level. I prefer to keep that rather than continue to add more things.

I don't dislike your ideas, but it does lead to adding more and more things which I would prefer to avoid. The point of these files (Custom - Spell Like Abilities, Custom - Universal Specials, Custom - Shared Customizable Specials) is to make things as versatile as possible while keeping the size of the data files down.
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Bloodwolf
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Old November 9th, 2020, 04:01 PM
Fair enough. I can agree that adding more is to be avoided.

So for the old "x" files that I change to "sla" files I'll use the naming formula from above. I changed them to make them fit in the new "xSplAb" files and to make them more generic.

Thanks
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Bloodwolf
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Old November 23rd, 2020, 08:48 PM
I got a question Sendric.

I have everything done and it works great as is.

Currently the xKeenSenses and typDragon files in the current HL build will have to be replaced with the xKeenSenses2 and typDragon2 files in my file. Obviously I expect the "2" to be removed after the file is replaced. I simply used that to work with like I put a 2 at the end of all the dragon file names.

The question is. Do you want me to send you the files with needing to change the xKeenSenses2 and typDragon2 bootstrapped files in every dragon on the list to xKeenSenses and typDragon files after the current versions are replaced or do you want me to remove it now so that they will just auto update after the original is replaced?

Hopefully I explained that well enough.
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Old November 23rd, 2020, 08:57 PM
I also put a doc in the Dropbox to explain what I did. Or at least I hope. Let me know if anything needs better explaining.
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