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Viperian
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Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 5

Old September 15th, 2010, 08:16 AM
To clarify my question a bit, it seems that HeroLab may be applying (incorrectly), the heavy horse template or some mix of horse and heavy horse, but it isn't listed as a heavy horse when you output to PDF. More importantly, the stats are wrong as shown onthe HeroLab character sheet.

HeroLab character sheet cavalier's horse companion stats:

Animal Companion, Male Horse - CL3 - CR 3
STR 17 (+3), DEX 14 (+2), CON 15 (+2), INT 2 (-4), WIS 12 (+1), CHA 6 (-2); Fortitude +5, Reflex +5, Will +2 HP: 26/26; Init: +2; Speed: 50 feet
Attack Bonus: +1; Armor Class: 17 / 11Tch / 15Fl
Acrobatics +6, Fly +0, Perception +5, Stealth -2, Survival +2
Bite (Horse) +4, 1d4+3, 20/x2
Hooves x2 (Horse) +0 x2, 1d6+1, 20/x2
Unarmed Strike +4, 1d4+3, 20/x2
Special: Combat Riding [Trick], Evasion (Ex), Fetch [Trick], Low-Light
Vision, Scent (Ex), Stay [Trick]


The horse's stats should be higher, according to the Pathfinder rules (+4 to all regular horse stats for a heavy horse, which uses the advanced simple template). They should be Str 20, Dex 18, Con 21, Int 2, Wis 17, Cha 11 -- reflecting a normal horse's ability scores, +4. Also, the to hit numbers appear to be wrong.


Below are the Pathfinder rules for creating a heavy warhorse:


Regular horse (not combat trained):

Regular horse to hit stats (Bestiary p.177): BAB +1 and Str 16 (+3) give it a +4 to hit. It has 2 hoof attacks which are secondary attacks (see "Docile (Ex)", below), incurring a -5 penalty. So, instead of +4 to hit with hooves, it should have a -1 to hit. However, the Bestiary lists it as -2 to hit. Is this a typo or am I missing something?


Docile (Ex) Unless specifically trained for combat (see the Handle
Animal skill on page 97 of the Pathfinder RPG Core Rulebook), a
horse’s hooves are treated as secondary attacks.

>>> This means that a __combat trained__ horse's hooves are primary attacks. So for a heavy warhorse, this means there is no -5 penalty for hoof attacks.




Heavy horse (not combat trained):

A heavy horse gains the advanced simple template (Bestiary p.177). Advanced simple template: +2 natural armor bonus; +4 to all ability scores (Bestiary p.294) In addition, it also gains a bite attack that inf licts 1d4 damage, and its hoof damage increases to 1d6.

Heavy horse to hit stats: BAB +1 and Str 20 (+5) give it a +6 to hit. It has 2 hoof attacks which are secondary attacks (see "Docile (Ex)", above) incurring a -5 penalty. So, instead of +6 to hit with hooves, it should have a +1 to hit. It also gets a bite attack, which we assume is a primary attack that incurs no penalties and should be at +6 to hit.




Heavy WARHORSE (trained for combat):

Same as a heavy horse, but since it's combat trained (see "Docile (Ex), above), its hooves do not count as secondary attacks. This means they are primary attacks, and don't suffer a -5 penalty to hit.

Heavy warhorse to hit stats: BAB +1 and Str 20 (+5) give it a +6 to hit. It has 2 hoof attacks which are __primary__ attacks (see "Docile (Ex)", above), at __+6__ to hit. It also gets a bite attack, which we assume is a primary attack and should be at +6 to hit.





Primary Attacks (Bestiary p.302):
Primary attacks are made using the creature’s full base attack bonus and add the creature’s full Strength bonus on damage rolls.

Secondary Attacks (Bestiary p.302):
Secondary attacks are made using the creature’s base attack bonus –5 and add only 1/2 the creature’s Strength bonus on damage
rolls.

Last edited by Viperian; September 15th, 2010 at 08:19 AM.
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