HL for the iPad
 

I just saw the news letter, and at first I was stoked! Then I noticed you said that the first release would be Playable Character sheet for Pathfinder, with more capabiltiy following on later.

I was wondering, wouldn't a playable character sheet only version of Hero Lab be capable of running other game systems?

I only ask because, in all honesty, I'd much rather be able to use my iPad to play all games via HL than have the ability to create characters and use the tactical console for one game...

Keep up the good work though!

There are a lot of variables involved here. One critical detail you may not realize is the implication of migrating the product from a desktop to the tablet platform. Because of dramatic differences in how the UI will be need to operate, we have to re-design significant chunks of the UI for the tablet. Each game system has its own UI behaviors scripted separately from other games, so each game system will require significant time to re-work its scripted UI.

Consequently, it's vastly better to do one game system completely before starting on any others. We'll be able to learn from it and refine the process at each evolutionary point in the game's development. This means we'll do a better and faster job on successive games, instead of having to go back and fixup all games every time we discover something that needs to be refined as we integrate new UI functionality.

The bottom line is that, if we were to do just a playable character sheet of each game system first, it will take us significantly longer to get everything done and will assuredly result in a lower quality end product. I can wholly understand the interest in having us do it that way, but it's just not an optimal approach from the standpoint of either efficiency or quality.

Hope this explanation makes sense. :)

Personally I've very very disappointed that you guys decided to go with the iOS first instead of Android. I understand why you made that decision, but it doesn't change the fact that I will refuse to use Apple, and that I already own a few Android devices. I really REALLY hope that you guys decide after implementing the Pathfinder stuff on iOS, that you'll look at implementing it on Android before going to other game systems.

I'm thrilled you made the decision to start with iOS. Now I just have to wait for the MnM 3e system implementation.... May have to get the Pathfinder dataset so I can play with it before then.

And their was much rejoicing! Yea!!! :) :D :D

I love my Macpro, can't stand IPads, oh well. I'll just bite my tongue and wait till the Android tablets can use Herolab.

EK

Probably will be a long time... like forever... for some reason even though Android tablets rock, everybody only loves the Ipad.

It'll definitely feel like it. I know the Lone Wolf guys work hard, and I love what they have made for us. I know that they can only do so much really, they aren't a big company with tons of programmers that can just churn this stuff out, but considering how impatient I feel about getting Android supported, I almost wish they were (but I never actually would want that, I just wish things could move faster).

FWIW, we feel the same way on our end. :)

Yeah for the tablet.

Yeah for iOS.

I understand why Pathfinder is first. Will wait mostly patiently for Shadowrun. Come on Shadowrun. Shouldn't the AI's do the work for you? :)

I am very happy to see progress for Hero Lab toward a tablet application. I also will have to wait until it makes it to an Android platform.

I was thinking, wouldn't it be easier to make a "tactical console app" for both platforms? I know I would buy that app in an instant. It is easy to transfer HL character files to any tablet ipad or android.

Then work on full blown version of Hero Lab for the tablet market.

I agree with Scargap. The only thing I really want for my Xoom is the Tactical Console. Preferably one that will load decent sized Shadowrun combats faster than the 20 minutes my dual core 4 GB Ram laptop takes.

20 minutes? i dunno, but it sounds ot me like something is wrong with your computer.

both my mac and pc load combats in a very short time. both of them have dial code and 4MB RAM. What else are you running when you're doing this??

A critical piece of the Tactical Console is to apply changes to the participants in a given combat, such as conditions, in-play adjustments, etc. Doing that requires that the entire Hero Lab engine exist on the platform so that all the proper calculations can be applied while observing all the proper rules for stacking and the like. If we don't have that, we have little more than a PDF viewer. So this isn't a viable solution. :(

That sure sounds like something is seriously different on your Xoom. How large are the portfolios you're loading (i.e. how many characters)? And what's the CPU on that device?

To my knowledge, those are the two biggest factors when loading for use in the Tactical Console, but Colen is the expert on that.

I think I'd rather see the move towards a web based UI for the character sheets and tactical console. That way you can run HL on a computer somewhere, and connect to it with various devices (from tablets, laptops, phones, etc). One HL installation could easily handle all the data for the whole party, PLUS NPC's, monsters, etc - while letting the lower powered portable devices stick to just displaying and handling UI.

I would be happy with a cut down tactical console that would import ac, cmd, cmb, name, character class. Then be able adjust intiatives for each character and keep track of character order.

It would save me a whole lot of typing :)

The big problem with a purely web-based approach is that everyone *has* to have an internet connection. There are still many gaming venues, especially large Cons, where internet access is unavailable, horribly slow, and/or expensive. So a purely web-based model is hamstrung out of the gate due to this limitation. We're using a hybrid approach with our upcoming Realm Works product, and we're looking at hybrid solutions for future use with Hero Lab as well.

You don't want access to any other info at all? And you don't want to fold you changes back into any saved portfolios?

How many others here would prefer something like that?

Not I. In fact Id rather have the portfolio data than tactical console. for the most part i find the character sheet and the ability to do adjustments the most useful vs the tactical console....

So go ahead with the iPad version, but for those of us who DO have internet wherever we go (most of us in our pocket) - any way you could at least implement some sort of API to request information from the HL running on a PC? Then the community could develop the web page's to display, and feedback updates to said data?

I doubt very much i would do very many character designs on my tablet. It is much easier to build characters on my desktop. Don't get me wrong, I will buy the HL for my android tablet when it becomes available... with one qualifier. It would have to use the data packs I have already bought for my desktop. I have bought 95% of the Pathfinder packs and don't relish the idea of buying them again.

It certainly would useful look at the character sheet as an option inside a combat app but i don't see any need to do any permanant adjustment to it.

By permanent adjustments, Rob also means changes like deleting a potion that you've drunk, or marking off the arrows you used, or recording the gold you spent paying for a ferry passage.

What i am looking for is an intiative tracker program that i can import the data in from my HL characters. Something similiar to "combat assistant" for the android platform. I certainly wouldnt say no to more features such as viewable character sheets and the like.

I thought about trying to program it myself, but i havent programmed for 20 years.

Adjusting these through the tactical console while interesting isn't important to me. This is something my players take care of with pen and paper. As the referee i don't any more details to take care.

Please don't do this. I use Hero Lab as a living character sheet, no matter what side of the screen I'm on. I actually don't use the tactical console, as d20Pro takes care of all that stuff.

I agree completely. In my opinion the Tactical Console is a nice-to-have, but the character sheet manipulation is a must have.

I've often wished that there was a way for my custom sheet to make HTTP requests back to Hero Lab. That would open up all kinds of slick possibilities! :cool:

For example, I could have the sheet--optionally--use a timer to make AJAX calls and check for updates periodically. That would allow the sheet to stay in sync with in-play adjustments without doing a complete regenerate of the sheet.

Exactly what I was envisioning as step one. Once the API is in place so that any 3rd party app/program could push/pull things/picks, and collections thereof, to and from HL, a LOT of options become available. Imagine an extension for already existing VTT softwares, for instance, that can simply call this data direct from HL in real time, instead of dealing with the export/change/re-import nightmares.

I would like this if HL actually imported into d20Pro right. As of now, I have to fix skills, modify attacks, and add actual effects to the abilities. If there was real time updates, then the things I have to fix with every import would just reset every few minutes. If

I too will be waiting for an Android version to come out even though I have an iPad aswell. I'm confused by the decision to launch on iOS as it's much more restrictive and Android allows for sales on many more manufacturers devices, hopefully the Android version isn't too far behind.

If its iOS vs android, you have a point, but if its tablet discussion the reality is that as a developer myself, i target the iPad first. There are still a lot more iPad users out there vs android tablet users. I imagine that too will change over time, but that time isnt here yet. Personalyl, im probably not going to use it on either, but as a developer, i can fully understand their reasoning.

While I've never used d20Pro, This is most likely a problem on d20Pro's end, not HL. That said, what I envision is to not even HAVE a 'import' step - but when ever d20Pro, or whatever VTT we are talking about needs a bit of info, it, instead of polling it's own database, makes an API call to the HL 'server'. In this way, data is always live and correct regardless of any changes from within the VTT or outside it (via a live character sheet app, for instance).

We output the data from Hero Lab that accurately reflects the character. The d20Pro software then interprets and transforms that data into what it needs. It's that second step where the problem most likely lies, so I recommend contacting the d20Pro team about any bugs that you've encountered.

For our first venture into this arena, we are focusing *solely* on the tablet. In the *tablet* space, the iPad vastly out-numbers the Android at the present time. On top of that, there are some major differences between all the different Android devices. Any native Android application has to successfully grapple with all of these differences.

If you'll recall from our announcement, our strategy is to tackle this incrementally. The Android platform, with all its wide-ranging devices and specs, simply makes for a more complicated task. That's counter to our strategy, which makes the iPad a better platform for us to tackle first.

Unless you go web based...

Please see my earlier post in this thread where I responded to *exactly* this same contention from you.

Nothing... not a single thing.

Windows 7 Pro x64 boots up, I launch HL... I load more than 5-6 NPCs into a profile to start the tactical console and we start chugging.

I had to load a combat for a Shadowrun Missions game I was running on tuesday, when I loaded the 18th NPC in... the PC locked up...

It could be the Shadowrun Ruleset for all I know. My 16 GB Quad Core system rocks this stuff... my Dual core 4GB 64-bit laptop dies. In this case literally... I've never had it overheat and shutdown due to temps before, but it did.

The Xoom is my android tablet :)

The Laptop that locks up is this one.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00...wms_ohs_produc

The only changes to the stock model I've made are to replace the HD with a 7200 rpm 750 GB one, and to install Windows 7 x64 Pro. The machine runs pretty good for its age... But HL causes it to struggle.

Can you please send us the portfolio(s) that you are loading? Then we can load them up ourselves and profile what's being used. Hopefully, that will yield some clues as to what's going on.

Please note that we leave for GenCon on Tuesday, so it's not likely we'll get much time to investigate this before we leave. Thanks in advance for your patience!

Oh, please send the portfolios to rob at wolflair dot com and I'll make sure they get routed appropriately.